Shame

[Mij]

It's not shame, you're just affirming you're lack of confidence. I had my first punt at 21 and kept it up throughout my 20s, I enjoyed it at the time, but I'd think back, like you are doing now, and feel like no woman would ever want to be with me if I didn't pay her.
Looking back now I was too young for this, I stopped in my 30s, got a girlfriend, got married, became a dad, got bored, and came back to this.
The difference now is that I know I am/have been loved, my confidence is so much better, that shame, or lack of confidence, is gone.
If I was advising my 25 year old self I'd say stop punting, find someone to build your confidence, and come back here again in the future. It's a great hobby, but not if it's getting you down.

[JennyIrish]

I'm a few years older than yourself , 29, and I remember feeling similar to you , even thinking about it the first time. As men were expected to be able to secure sexual partners , in school and college etc if someone doesn't get laid they are slagged and made feel inferior and we develop under that pre-text that if we can't get women we are failures and lesser men. I'd imagine that's where a lot of your shame is coming from, am I such a failure that I actually have to pay for it ?

Once you stop and think about it logically , ok I am paying for a service , it's going to be infinitely quicker than going on dating apps and trying to find someone , most of the ladies on here are absolute super models that you'd never pull regardless in the 'real world' , you can get exactly what you are looking for with your dream looking girl , and it'll all be carried out professionally to please you and really it's cheaper than trying to organise a date. Get new clothes , pay for a restaurant and drinks and taxi etc and then maybe not even end up having sex. Once you've had that one really good meet with a beautiful woman you're whole thinking will change.

I made the novice mistake of visiting some ladies with with reviews turned off, and there's definitely a totally different feel of meeting someone with little to no English , in a seedy apartment , who doesn't provide a good service and all feels forced , no chat after. It's definitely much easier to feel shameful when your first experiences are like that. But once you meet an established girl , in a nice place who genuinely enjoys their work , your entire perception will change trust me. I've made friends with several ladies I've met , helped them set up Irish bank accounts and with documents so they could get rental agreements etc, the women who have the stones to work in this industry and the ones who enjoy it will be unlike any person you'll ever meet in the normal world and you'll learn to appreciate and value them and revel in the experiences they can provide.

There's also something both incredibly liberating and exciting knowing you have access to some of the most beautiful women in the country ready to fulfil all your desires at your fingertips , as opposed to fawning over social media apps swiping through girls who you'll never have a chance with.

Keep at it , think logically and if you haven't already visit some of the more well reviewed ladies on here , be very vocal about your desires beforehand , let me tell you there will be no shame felt when you leave a meet with a beautiful woman totally drained and satisfied exactly how you imagined.

Well written, very mature thinking for 29! I agree with every word, however I would agree with other posters that perhaps the OP needs to work on his confidence a bit with ladies his own age first to get into a better headspace. Although from what I hear from younger clients, the dating scene is impossible nowadays, it's all on apps and it's hard to form a connection with anyone. I also hear that ladies are incredibly fussy and it's ironic because i have some beautiful single friends who complain that they cant find a guy!

One younger client I have who is a real 'cheeky chappie' type told me one of his methods for pulling on a night out is he'll spot a cute girl and go over, take the straw out of her drink and walk off, lol and of course 9 times out of 10 she'll follow him, that made me laugh!

To the op dont give up with ladies your own age, I promise you, the older you get the less you give a fcuk what others think and your confidence grows xx

[Averageatbest93]

Thanks Jenny , your opinion is always well valued. To follow on from your post, it is largely impossible for young men to build confidence nowadays, the dating scene as mentioned is largely online and as such is totally geared towards women having the power. Due to the vastly different beauty standards an 'average' looking man has no hope on these apps, women as you mentioned have become incredibly fussy.

This is largely due to inflated egos caused by these apps , even a 'average' looking woman will have dozens of matches and messages from men on a daily basis where as a man will have none unless he is in the top 5% of men in turns of being exceptionally handsome or exceptionally fit. Not to mention how easy it is for women to build followers on insta and TikTok and this has just further caused them to have even bigger heads, you wouldn't believe how often conversations in real life , at a bar or a club etc gets turned back to women bragging about their followers. It doesn't help that everyone is addicted to their phones also and many people of that age group totally lack any social skills.

To give you some idea I watched a study done by a fella on Tinder recently , an average or maybe slightly above average guy a strong 7/10 by most people's standards , relatively handsome , in good shape , dressed nicely in all his pictures. He swiped right on 5000 women indiscriminately , he got 1200 matches , he messaged 400 women himself. Only 20 women from the 1200 he matched messaged him first. From the 400 he messaged only 28 replied , between the women who messaged him and the ones who replied to his messages he managed to organize 3 dates , one stood him up and ghosted him afterwards , one cancelled due to being sick , and one showed up and she was seriously different than her own photos which were heavily filtered. So that's 1 date, an above average looking guy was able to get , from a pool of 5000 women.

So to summarize , women can afford to be highly selective where as men cannot. Imagine how bruising to the ego it must be facing rejection constantly , back in the day you might chance it on with one woman a night at a bar and if it didn't go well then fair enough , 1 rejection a week we could all live with, but thousands a day essentially ? I would say there are a lot of young men walking around with an inferiority complex these days as a result.

[john40]

I posted this very topic a few years ago. Don't ask me why, but I also used to feel like that after every meeting at the start. With a lot of support from replies here, I got over it and really enjoyed every encounter from then on. There's nothing to be ashamed about. We all deserve some fun every now and then, right ? Like others have said. The only shame is on this country that it's not legal and therefore safer for everyone involved. Enjoy the ride 😀

[JennyIrish]

Thanks Jenny , your opinion is always well valued. To follow on from your post, it is largely impossible for young men to build confidence nowadays, the dating scene as mentioned is largely online and as such is totally geared towards women having the power. Due to the vastly different beauty standards an 'average' looking man has no hope on these apps, women as you mentioned have become incredibly fussy.

This is largely due to inflated egos caused by these apps , even a 'average' looking woman will have dozens of matches and messages from men on a daily basis where as a man will have none unless he is in the top 5% of men in turns of being exceptionally handsome or exceptionally fit. Not to mention how easy it is for women to build followers on insta and TikTok and this has just further caused them to have even bigger heads, you wouldn't believe how often conversations in real life , at a bar or a club etc gets turned back to women bragging about their followers. It doesn't help that everyone is addicted to their phones also and many people of that age group totally lack any social skills.

To give you some idea I watched a study done by a fella on Tinder recently , an average or maybe slightly above average guy a strong 7/10 by most people's standards , relatively handsome , in good shape , dressed nicely in all his pictures. He swiped right on 5000 women indiscriminately , he got 1200 matches , he messaged 400 women himself. Only 20 women from the 1200 he matched messaged him first. From the 400 he messaged only 28 replied , between the women who messaged him and the ones who replied to his messages he managed to organize 3 dates , one stood him up and ghosted him afterwards , one cancelled due to being sick , and one showed up and she was seriously different than her own photos which were heavily filtered. So that's 1 date, an above average looking guy was able to get , from a pool of 5000 women.

So to summarize , women can afford to be highly selective where as men cannot. Imagine how bruising to the ego it must be facing rejection constantly , back in the day you might chance it on with one woman a night at a bar and if it didn't go well then fair enough , 1 rejection a week we could all live with, but thousands a day essentially ? I would say there are a lot of young men walking around with an inferiority complex these days as a result.

Wow, the results of that study are astounding!!

Another example, a client I have, late 20s, handsome, great job also has a farm. So he works crazy hours, he told me hes given up on women because anyone hes gone out with gives out about how much he works and the relationship wont work because of this, I was like "whaaaaaaat?!" In my 20s I would have fallen over myself for a guy like that!

But also theres the problem, so many guys are just looking for a quick hook up. So ladies genuinley looking for a relationship, how do you weed through guys like this? I know one guy who claims to text "goodnight" to 10 ladies due to Tinder. So ladies are going to be wary too I suppose.

[bananabox999]

I do feel for the younger people these days, and im not even old lol. Social media has ruined genuine connections. It cant be easy to meet people. Maybe the result will be people getting into relationships at an older age, which in fairness could be a good thing. Honestly id tell anyone in their 20's not to get into anything serious. 90% of people dont have a clue what they want in life at that age.

[AmorInfinito8]

[QUOTE=Averageatbest93;3253233]

So that's 1 date, an above average looking guy was able to get , from a pool of 5000 women.

I knew it was bad out there but those statistics scare the crap out of even me!!
I've never joined one of these sites but it has been a consideration for the future,
But that tends to put the whole thing into a different perspective.
I get on really well with women in real life but I think that could be because I don't have any ulterior motives well not at the moment,
I don't try to chat them up or put the move's on, because I'm not interested,
maybe that's what tweaks their curiosity!
I'm no Brad Pitt but I didn't hit too many branches on the way down,
I have been told by a guy in the past
(He's older than me and I'd think I'm a bit better looking and in much better physical shape)
of a hook-up site he was using and was meeting women pretty regularly,
but that was literally just for sex not a relationship, and it wasn't Escorts

[Noregrets]

Thanks Jenny , your opinion is always well valued. To follow on from your post, it is largely impossible for young men to build confidence nowadays, the dating scene as mentioned is largely online and as such is totally geared towards women having the power. Due to the vastly different beauty standards an 'average' looking man has no hope on these apps, women as you mentioned have become incredibly fussy.

This is largely due to inflated egos caused by these apps , even a 'average' looking woman will have dozens of matches and messages from men on a daily basis where as a man will have none unless he is in the top 5% of men in turns of being exceptionally handsome or exceptionally fit. Not to mention how easy it is for women to build followers on insta and TikTok and this has just further caused them to have even bigger heads, you wouldn't believe how often conversations in real life , at a bar or a club etc gets turned back to women bragging about their followers. It doesn't help that everyone is addicted to their phones also and many people of that age group totally lack any social skills.

To give you some idea I watched a study done by a fella on Tinder recently , an average or maybe slightly above average guy a strong 7/10 by most people's standards , relatively handsome , in good shape , dressed nicely in all his pictures. He swiped right on 5000 women indiscriminately , he got 1200 matches , he messaged 400 women himself. Only 20 women from the 1200 he matched messaged him first. From the 400 he messaged only 28 replied , between the women who messaged him and the ones who replied to his messages he managed to organize 3 dates , one stood him up and ghosted him afterwards , one cancelled due to being sick , and one showed up and she was seriously different than her own photos which were heavily filtered. So that's 1 date, an above average looking guy was able to get , from a pool of 5000 women.

So to summarize , women can afford to be highly selective where as men cannot. Imagine how bruising to the ego it must be facing rejection constantly , back in the day you might chance it on with one woman a night at a bar and if it didn't go well then fair enough , 1 rejection a week we could all live with, but thousands a day essentially ? I would say there are a lot of young men walking around with an inferiority complex these days as a result.

Wow thats dreadful reading, I don't doubt its accuracy either.

Here's my twopence worth, join a football club or any other team sport.

Dump the dating sites and actually start going to places. Widen your circle of friends that way. And stay off dating apps they will destroy you. Get off social media in general and when you get talking to girls you might fancy give them your actual number not an insta they can creep on.

I know it's a rant and not making much sense but get into a real world there's loads.of lonely.girls in it also fed up of the fake profiles on dating apps.

[Nononsense111]

FreeWilly, I'm the same age as you and have been punting for 3/4 years, longer than my current relationship with my gf lol

How people feel after a meet is personal. To my earlier contribution, I don't feel any shame, I really enjoy the time spent and chemistry developed with these woman, from all corners of the planet. As a lad in my 20s, a lot of people our age don't truly know what they want, and often rush into things just to keep family, friends and nosy relations satisfied. A lot of my close friends are in terrible relationships, like me. I don't know why we do it to ourselves. They fight, they bicker, they lose interest and its all over the most ridiculous stuff. I know my and my friends situation doesn't speak to everyone, some people have the most wonderful relationships. But I do question the sustainability and long term future of many relationships people my age are in.

For me, punting is my time where I can forget about the daily shite that goes on. I don't have to worry about car repayments, my job, my gf nagging me or giving out. I spend most of my waking hours keeping working, going to the gym, helping my gf with her final year of studies or looking after my parents. Its nice to have my own time, where I can slip off and visit a lady.

There's 168 hours in a week, if I spend 0.5-1.5 of those hours punting, my week gets better tenfold.

Freewilly, for you, your mental and physical wellbeing is paramount. If meeting ladies on here brings you feelings of shame, then perhaps you should try to find other ways to be happy.

All the best my man

[JennyIrish]

It must be so hard for people in op's age group, 2 years of online school/college, no social interaction, now working from home is practically becoming the norm. Pub culture isnt what it was, where you'd meet people and have the craic, I'm sure that there are so many young people who feel so isolated.