First prosecution under Nordic model

[MidlifeCrisis]

Sweet fucking hell.
The word farcical simply isn't enough.

I think clusterfuck is the word for this.

Better acknowledge the possibility though that this woman is a genuine victim, and maybe came under pressure not to.attend.

[meatloaf2]

Crazy, meanwhile this poor guy get more media attention and life turned upside down.
It would not be difficult for the PSNI to prove it was a Brothel and in most cases these type escorts involved will cut some sort of deal and thus getting the client convicted.

I know that place and I know of the girls, everything was fake about it, Also we have forum members on here leaving positive reviews for them and misleading other guys and then guys thinking shes the best thing from sliced bread.
Do you feel for this guy

[SteveB]

Crazy, meanwhile this poor guy get more media attention and life turned upside down.
It would not be difficult for the PSNI to prove it was a Brothel and in most cases these type escorts involved will cut some sort of deal and thus getting the client convicted.

I know that place and I know of the girls, everything was fake about it, Also we have forum members on here leaving positive reviews for them and misleading other guys and then guys thinking shes the best thing from sliced bread.
Do you feel for this guy

Don't think I know the place or the girl unless I was there and didn't catch on. PM to enlighten me please?

[AZ99]

Do you feel for this guy?_._we make our own decisions in life ._.Sometimes unwisely._.If he could not assess the situation and then act then No i dont .

Stupid logic.

Hindsight is 20/20. It's easy to sit there at your keyboard and say he should have assessed the situation, but we weren't in his position and there may have been factors which weren't obvious to him that are now obvious to us.

And how is "we make our own decisions in life" any justification for someone receiving a criminal record for doing nothing wrong? Even if it was obvious that he would get arrested, and he was arrested anyway, that's no justification or rationale for saying that he somehow deserved it. This is the same mentality that exists in authoritarian states; "if you're prosecuted, it's your fault because you broke the law." Well, that's not the point. The point is, this law shouldn't exist.

[SteveB]

Several possible scenarios here, but I was hoping that it was a case that the police where attempting to bluff (and intimidate) him into accepting a caution.

If that is the case, the police bluff has been called and their "injured party/witness" is unwilling to say the least. Hopefully the whole case will just collapse.

[Barney Rubble]

I met 2 ladies last week in 2 different locations and on both occasions there was a Garda car spinning about. I just ignored them and continued with my appointment BUT if I had have been arrested would I be thinking to myself that I should have known better and to have left ? Fuck No!! I grew up tripping over the security forces and learnt to ignore them. If you're gonna be caught you're gonna be caught, end of story. Although looking and acting suspicious really doesn't help.

[John Thomas]

so i'm a bit confused tonight - I read again the legislation and I am not picking up that a mere attempt to purchase sexual services is an offence?

Paying for sexual services of a person
15.—(1) The Sexual Offences (Northern Ireland) Order 2008 is amended as follows.

(2) In the heading to Part 5, after “PROSTITUTION” insert “AND PAYING FOR SEXUAL SERVICES OF A PERSON”.

(3) In Article 58 (interpretation of this Part) at the end of paragraph (3) insert “other than in Article 64A”.

(4) Article 59 (loitering or soliciting for purposes of prostitution) is repealed.

(5) For Article 64A (paying for sexual services of a prostitute subjected to force etc.) substitute—

“Paying for sexual services of a person
64A.—(1) A person (A) commits an offence if A obtains sexual services from a person (B)in exchange for payment—

(a)if the payment is made or promised by A; or
(b)if the payment is made or promised by a third party and A knows or believes that the payment is made or promised by a third party.
(2) A person guilty of an offence under this Article is liable—

(a)on summary conviction to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum, or both;
(b)on conviction on indictment to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one year or a fine, or both.
(3) In paragraph (1), “payment” means any financial advantage to B, or any person other than B, including the discharge of an obligation to pay or the provision of goods or services (other than sexual services)gratuitously or at a discount.

(4) No offence is committed under this Article unless the sexual services that are provided or are to be provided by B to A involve—

(a)B being physically in A’s presence,
(b)B touching A or A touching B, and
(c)the touching being sexual; or
(d)B touching B in a sexual manner for the sexual gratification of A, B being physically in A’s presence.
(5) B does not commit an offence by doing anything which (apart from this paragraph) would amount to—

(a)aiding, abetting, counselling or procuring the commission of an offence under this Article by A;
(b)conspiring with A to commit an offence under this Article; or
(c)an offence under Part 2 of the Serious Crime Act 2007 (encouraging or assisting offences) in relation to the commission of an offence under this Article by A.”.



that is A actually obtains sexual services from B? for it to be an offence. The media have reported it as an attempt although steveb's posting seems to suggest it was actual sexual service

interestingly i have just spotted that escorts cannot be prosecuted for incitement to commit the offence- so our Romanian car washer cannot be prosecuted herself

methinks the guy had sex in the garage witnessed by PSNI but escort ( who is a person under the legislation) did not make the complaint nevertheless is the 'injured person'

we all know who runs these girls in the end and she will never turn up

in the end it will not be legislative interpretation or clever twisting of words that makes this ' crime' impossible to prosecute but rather just like the old days witnesses and i mean fundamentally the 'seller' of sexual services know that turning up for court is not really a good idea for all sorts of reasons

[AZ99]

that is A actually obtains sexual services from B? for it to be an offence. The media have reported it as an attempt

It says "if the payment is made or promised by A"

... which is funny, because in theory, it means A could book a time to see B at her apartment and walk through her door without doing anything illegal (yet), so long as A didn't discuss any sexual services or payment.

[John Thomas]

It says "if the payment is made or promised by A"

... which is funny, because in theory, it means A could book a time to see B at her apartment and walk through her door without doing anything illegal (yet), so long as A didn't discuss any sexual services or payment.

still has to 'obtain the sexual service' whether or not paid up front or afterwards

if no sexual service then no crime

[The Libertarian]

It seems that without an escort turning up to be a witness, it may be impossible to get a conviction in The North, except for the possibility of being actually caught by The Pigz 'in situ' in a brothel, during a raid!
I guess though if a complaint was made by an 'injured party', The Pigz will investigate.
In a capitalist based society which is all about buying and selling, the idea of offering an 'adult civvie' let alone an escort, money for a bit of craic, is hardly crime of the century!