Killing of new borns allowed, they have no right to life

[Dub Lad]

im not talking about downs here but severe cases, children born without rectums, serve physical deformation, internal organs outside the body, no brain etc etc, im talking about exterme cases here,

yes right to life, but wud u want a life of pain, and maybe be brain dead, ur just trapped there,

thats not a life

Ok firstly the rectum, they can infact treat this and as time goes on science and medicine get's better and gives a better quality of life, but it can be done, but if you considered that as severe that baby would be dead now? because you deemed it a severe case?
As for organs outside the body yup it has happens and over the decades medicine has caught up and you can detect and treat these issues.

[samlad]

A very difficult topic here. When my youngest daughter was in the womb, the scan showed a cavity in her head. The doctors and nurses huddled around me and my ex-wife and said that this is a cyst in the brain, which is usually an indicator that an unborn child might have Edward's Syndrome. This is basically when a child has a trace or a full extra 18th chromosome which usually causes abnormalities of the vital organs and there is virtually no survival rate from this. A child would die within weeks.

We were offered the medical intervention of an amniocentesis, which basically meant that they would stick a big needle in the unborn baby's head to extract some of the amniotic fluid from the cyst to determine whether or not this was the case. We were told that this procedure could kill the baby (who at this time was about 4-5 months if memory serves). We took our chances and declined. We decided whatever happened, we would be prepared to deal with whatever nature chose.

Needless to say, we were on tender-hooks for the remainder of the pregnancy. I witnessed the birth of my little girl (as I did with my other girls ) and thank goodness she was completely healthy with no abnormalities. I discussed this with the mid-wives and was basically told that because scanning technology was so good now, people are being needlessly worried because it is picking up too much detail! Would you believe it?! Should we have agreed to the procedure, my daughter might not be with us now.

It's definitely a controversial topic in Ireland, given that the Pro-life activists feel that abortion alone is murder and that is another debate. The experience I had above was real and in the put two people in a situation where we could have intervened. I can honestly hand on heart say that should my daughter have been born with that severe condition and I had the option to kill her, I don't think I would have the heart to do it. However, that doesn't mean I don't understand the logic behind people's thinking that would actually do it. A parent may think that they are doing the right thing by preventing a life of pain, suffering and premature death. Some may argue that this is nature's selection and by having all this medicine and technology, we are breeding a world of weak humans, but whatever the debate, I couldn't and wouldn't bring myself to allow this.

[Doozer]

If you take emotions out of it and have a logical medical ethics debate then it could make sense , however.humans aren't purly logical and every action has emotion involved. As sam said if he went down logical avenue his daughter may not be here

[Lincoln]

I know medical experts are tasked to tease out ethical issues and its a vital job in medicine.

The position here, though, is ludicrous. They say they are applying the same circumstances as if the baby were still in utero.

The delivered child isnt a threat to the mothers life and is no longer integral to her body. These are the 2 primary circumstances in which abortion will be performed i.e. as a medical impertive or as post conception birth control.

I think the academics posing the idea are on ground so shaky here as to be non-existent.

[Skeletor]

im not talking about downs here but severe cases, children born without rectums, serve physical deformation, internal organs outside the body, no brain etc etc, im talking about exterme cases here,

yes right to life, but wud u want a life of pain, and maybe be brain dead, ur just trapped there,

thats not a life

well said when the disability is so severe there is no quality of life

[JohnRambo]

I promised myself I’d try my best to stay out of this discussion because I knew there would be some very stupid and selfish posts some people would make and I wouldn’t like but even I was surprised at some of the trash I’ve read here.

Firstly I want to ask who has the right to decide what child lives and what child dies all because they might not be born in some people’s eyes as being “the perfect child?” Is it the medical profession because they think of the medical costs it’ll cost the health service to help and prolong this child life over the next amount of years? Or is it the parents all because they feel they don’t have what it takes to look after, care for and love that child the same unconditional way they do the rest of their children?

Next we have to think do we draw up some sort of criteria with say tick boxes that the child most pass in order for it to live? Say like, deformities, if the child isn’t born with two arms and two legs does that cover the criteria to kill it? What if its going to be born deaf or blind? Again the child is going to have a more difficult life that the “normal” but again perhaps it too should be just killed because of the extra hassle it’ll bring society. Where is the line going to be drawn if we’re really going to go down this route of deciding who lives and who dies?

Even before a child with a disability is born the medical will paint the worst most bleak picture to the parents of what to expect for their child throughout its life even though in most cases they get it totally wrong as most children with disabilities go on to lead very happy and productive lives.

The way some people are talking here its no different than what Hitler was looking to do back in the 1930’s, he wanted to create the “perfect race” and all those within society that didn’t fit into this were thought of as “undesirables” and murdered all before the Jews and other sections in society didn’t meet his vision either.

[Skeletor]

I promised myself I’d try my best to stay out of this discussion because I knew there would be some very stupid and selfish posts some people would make and I wouldn’t like but even I was surprised at some of the trash I’ve read here.

Firstly I want to ask who has the right to decide what child lives and what child dies all because they might not be born in some people’s eyes as being “the perfect child?” Is it the medical profession because they think of the medical costs it’ll cost the health service to help and prolong this child life over the next amount of years? Or is it the parents all because they feel they don’t have what it takes to look after, care for and love that child the same unconditional way they do the rest of their children?

Next we have to think do we draw up some sort of criteria with say tick boxes that the child most pass in order for it to live? Say like, deformities, if the child isn’t born with two arms and two legs does that cover the criteria to kill it? What if its going to be born deaf or blind? Again the child is going to have a more difficult life that the “normal” but again perhaps it too should be just killed because of the extra hassle it’ll bring society. Where is the line going to be drawn if we’re really going to go down this route of deciding who lives and who dies?

Even before a child with a disability is born the medical will paint the worst most bleak picture to the parents of what to expect for their child throughout its life even though in most cases they get it totally wrong as most children with disabilities go on to lead very happy and productive lives.

The way some people are talking here its no different than what Hitler was looking to do back in the 1930’s, he wanted to create the “perfect race” and all those within society that didn’t fit into this were thought of as “undesirables” and murdered all before the Jews and other sections in society didn’t meet his vision either.

bear in mind its the level of disability which is been referred to here of course people with certain disabilities live very good lives but there is NO quality of life with some very severe disabilities

[JohnRambo]

bear in mind its the level of disability which is been referred to here of course people with certain disabilities live very good lives but there is NO quality of life with some very severe disabilities

Yes but who or what decides that the child would be better off dead? Who has the right to make that decision? Who's there to give the child a voice to say give them a chance?

[jay67]

I promised myself I’d try my best to stay out of this discussion because I knew there would be some very stupid and selfish posts some people would make and I wouldn’t like but even I was surprised at some of the trash I’ve read here.

Firstly I want to ask who has the right to decide what child lives and what child dies all because they might not be born in some people’s eyes as being “the perfect child?” Is it the medical profession because they think of the medical costs it’ll cost the health service to help and prolong this child life over the next amount of years? Or is it the parents all because they feel they don’t have what it takes to look after, care for and love that child the same unconditional way they do the rest of their children?

Next we have to think do we draw up some sort of criteria with say tick boxes that the child most pass in order for it to live? Say like, deformities, if the child isn’t born with two arms and two legs does that cover the criteria to kill it? What if its going to be born deaf or blind? Again the child is going to have a more difficult life that the “normal” but again perhaps it too should be just killed because of the extra hassle it’ll bring society. Where is the line going to be drawn if we’re really going to go down this route of deciding who lives and who dies?

Even before a child with a disability is born the medical will paint the worst most bleak picture to the parents of what to expect for their child throughout its life even though in most cases they get it totally wrong as most children with disabilities go on to lead very happy and productive lives.

The way some people are talking here its no different than what Hitler was looking to do back in the 1930’s, he wanted to create the “perfect race” and all those within society that didn’t fit into this were thought of as “undesirables” and murdered all before the Jews and other sections in society didn’t meet his vision either.

well said john, i was the same when i started reading this thread.life is precious!! and to me any child's life is even more precious.

jay67

[JohnRambo]

well said john, i was the same when i started reading this thread.life is precious!! and to me any child's life is even more precious.

jay67

Problem is jay67 to some people some lives are more precious than others.