Trafficking.

[Mioux]

yeah this is a bit weird.
i wasn't 'arguing' any particular point of view or 'fighting' with anyone,
i think he kind of decided to add to what i was saying and got defensive.

[Doozer]

yeah this is a bit weird.
i wasn't 'arguing' any particular point of view or 'fighting' with anyone,
i think he kind of decided to add to what i was saying and got defensive.

Te are both talking about different sides of the same coin
Ye both have very valid pionts but from your own point of view
Unfortunatly neither of ye will probably agree on each others points which is fair enough

Just there is no need to fall out over it

[Mioux]

i wasn't arguing any point of view to do with legal stuff at all. or anything really. i just made a passing comment and he decided to pick a fight. about nothing. and we're not friends so there won't be any falling out.

there was a reason i left this website!

[Doozer]

i wasn't arguing any point of view to do with legal stuff at all. or anything really. i just made a passing comment and he decided to pick a fight. about nothing. and we're not friends so there won't be any falling out.

there was a reason i left this website!

Ok fair enough, Argue all you want
Thats good just keep it civil is all Im asking

[Mioux]

how was i not keeping it civil?
and for the third time, i wasn't and had no intentions on 'arguing'.
you're making this into some sort of weird issue.

[Doozer]

how was i not keeping it civil?
and for the third time, i wasn't and had no intentions on 'arguing'.
you're making this into some sort of weird issue.

I apologise if I have gotten this wrong
Carry on

[Bruno69]

Mioux, I'm sure we are on the same side here. You just rubbed me up the wrong way with a comment you made straight after my first post. If I misinterpreted it, I apologize.

So...

X

Goodnight

[Bodkin]

Trafficking, this is a serious and emotive term, but just
saying it a few times is not evidence of how common it is.

The general public don't visit this site or go and meet escorts
so they will believe what is told to them, regardless of the truth
or motives of the agency projecting that view.

In The Journal poll thread, i read a poster to complain that women
were forced to see random, deficient men?

Watch the video below, voice tone, body language leads me
to question the real motives of the TORL campaign. Toward the
end the woman who should be concerned with immigrants says
"this is what we feel fuels sex trafficking."

YouTube - Human Trafficking in Ireland

It is insane, though not surprising, that we now have to fight for basic rights and legal protection of people working in the sex industry in this country. However given that we have this fight on our hands it's imperative that we don't bloody lose it!

One area where we, the turn off the blue light side of the "debate," are at risk of tripping ourselves up is trying to pretend that everything is rosy in the garden and that all we need is for independent escorts to be free to operate with the full protection of the law. There is more to it than that. There are evil bastards exploiting poor people, there always have been, and there always will be.

Trafficking is a problem, but it is classic dogmatic ultra-rightwing conservative knee-jerk self-promoting sanctimonious catholic propoganda to claim that *every* escort in Ireland is a victim of trafficking. Sadly, as the OP points out, the average Joe will buy this bullshit as there appear to be a terrifying number of people who actually believe what they read in the media. Tragic but true.

As ever, this mess is complex. It is not black & white. There are for example independent workers here who were in the past trafficked and have managed to work their way out of the situation and get to a point where they are operating on their own and making a decent living. The proposed laws will undo all the hard and dangerous work that such good people have done to improve their lives.

The real problem with "Trafficking" as a concept is that it is a media label -- a tabloid byword for all that is grotty & miserable & guaranteed to sell newspapers. We will have a hell of a time fighting public perception (or rather public misconceptions) as it is without making matters worse for ourselves by trying to deny the real problems.

If we truly want the Turn off the blue light campaign to succeed we must be clear, coherent, articulate, and mature in our debate. Our stance must be informed and honest. If we come across as a rabble of kinksters just trying to maintain the status quo, we will written off as sexual degenerates being used as pawns of the organised crime vested interests who "control" the sex industry in Ireland. That would be a disaster for all of us.

[Mioux]

no, the real problem with trafficking is that is exists. very much so.

[Bruno69]

Excellent post Bodkin