The Pity Stage

[El Gordo]

Please refer to my last post in this thread: https://www.escort-ireland.com/board...sh-people.html

Since you're referring everyone to that post, and since I can't reply on that thread, I'd just like to say something here. In that post you refer to one of my posts, which was of the "I understand what you're saying, but..." variety. Now you only mention the "I understand what you're saying" part of it, and leave out the "but..." part. It's accurate in so far as it goes. The "I understand what you're saying" part wasn't just a rhetorical device. I really do understand. However, leaving out the "but..." part leaves the impression that I think the rule and decision are correct, which I don't. So would you mind removing the reference to me from that post? I think it gives people the wrong impression of what I was saying, even though I'm sure you didn't mean it that way.

Some of the mods do speak Irish fluently, however as we have to react quickly to certain issues and the Irish speaking mods cannot always be on all the time, it would make things impossible to moderate sufficiently.

I don't really think that section would really require constant attention. Just someone to pop in once a month and dust off the cobwebs.

[samlad]

Since you're referring everyone to that post, and since I can't reply on that thread, I'd just like to say something here. In that post you refer to one of my posts, which was of the "I understand what you're saying, but..." variety. Now you only mention the "I understand what you're saying" part of it, and leave out the "but..." part. It's accurate in so far as it goes. The "I understand what you're saying" part wasn't just a rhetorical device. I really do understand. However, leaving out the "but..." part leaves the impression that I think the rule and decision are correct, which I don't. So would you mind removing the reference to me from that post? I think it gives people the wrong impression of what I was saying, even though I'm sure you didn't mean it that way.


I don't really think that section would really require constant attention. Just someone to pop in once a month and dust off the cobwebs.

LOL! I don't use language as a means of rhetoric with the perceived cliche of 'I understand what you're saying'. The thing is, I do understand where you are coming from; I am not one dimensionally minded, El Gordo, and do consider things from a range of perspectives. I can genuinely see the points you are making in all their clarity, but I do have to counter the idea if there is reason for it.

[Forrest]

Please refer to my last post in this thread: https://www.escort-ireland.com/board...sh-people.html

Some of the mods do speak Irish fluently, however as we have to react quickly to certain issues and the Irish speaking mods cannot always be on all the time, it would make things impossible to moderate sufficiently.

That is a cop out Sam. I have read your final comment on Dolly's thread and you put forward a reasoned argument, but this country's mother tongue is Irish and if a few people wish to converse, and try to re-ignite the use of Irish in daily life, they should be allowed to do so. Setting up an Irish speaking section for those people that can speak and write fluently in Irish should not be a big challenge for E-I and moderating it wouldn't break the bank either.
I don't expect there to be a proliferation of Irish speaking on the forums even if the rule was removed. I am not a fluent Irish speaker and I am a bit embarrassed by that fact, so I would enjoy reading threads in an Irish section(with an English translation), to help me get back some of the knowledge I learned all those years ago in school.
I know there have been great improvements on E-I over the past 3-4 years, because management listened to some of the ideas put forward by members. This is just another opportunity to listen to the people that help fund the site.

[samlad]

That is a cop out Sam. I have read your final comment on Dolly's thread and you put forward a reasoned argument, but this country's mother tongue is Irish and if a few people wish to converse, and try to re-ignite the use of Irish in daily life, they should be allowed to do so. Setting up an Irish speaking section for those people that can speak and write fluently in Irish should not be a big challenge for E-I and moderating it wouldn't break the bank either.
I don't expect there to be a proliferation of Irish speaking on the forums even if the rule was removed. I am not a fluent Irish speaker and I am a bit embarrassed by that fact, so I would enjoy reading threads in an Irish section(with an English translation), to help me get back some of the knowledge I learned all those years ago in school.
I know there have been great improvements on E-I over the past 3-4 years, because management listened to some of the ideas put forward by members. This is just another opportunity to listen to the people that help fund the site.

Sorry you feel that way Forrest. I can assure you though that we do take on board ideas, but just because we don't find them feasible enough to implement, it doesn't mean that we haven't listened and considered them.

[Forrest]

Sorry you feel that way Forrest. I can assure you though that we do take on board ideas, but just because we don't find them feasible enough to implement, it doesn't mean that we haven't listened and considered them.

I do realise that some ideas are taken on board, as I have already mentioned that some of the improvements on E-I have come from suggestions/requests from the members. I doubt if E-I is in any great financial difficulty that a part-time Gaelgoir moderator couldn't be easily funded.

[Mousey]

Sorry you feel that way Forrest.

No you aren't.

I can assure you though that we do take on board ideas

No you don't.

but just because we don't find them feasible enough to implement, it doesn't mean that we haven't listened and considered them.

Yes it does.

LOL! I don't use language as a means of rhetoric with the perceived cliche of 'I understand what you're saying'.

Yes you do.

The thing is, I do understand where you are coming from

No you don't.

I am not one dimensionally minded

Yes you are.

and do consider things from a range of perspectives.

No you don't.

I can genuinely see the points you are making in all their clarity

No you can't.

but I do have to counter the idea if there is reason for it

No you don't.






I like this game

[Experienced Punter esq]

compromise is the key here its no failure on the parts of mods if you gotta change a rule people dont wanna be spoken to like children now that I have spoken I trust threads will be unlocked Go raibh maith agat...

[samlad]

I have gone through a number of stages since the issue regarding Irish came up. I think I go through the astonishment stage fairly regularly on this forum. It always astonishes me when moderators ( including community managers ) make an obvious cock-up, have it very clearly, politely, and repeatedly pointed out how idiotic the decisions were ( and I'm being very careful to criticise the decisions here, and not the person making them ), and then dive squarely behind the rule book for cover, stubbernly quoting the rules, as if they were reading from Bunracht na hEireann.

Sometimes this progresses to Rage. Seeing the rules facilitate injustice, and the moderators enforce that injustice, moves me from the astonishment stage to Rage. A couple of examples spring to mind. The prolonged refusal to unrat JessicaJessys review when not only did both the reviewer, and a reputable escort confirm the meeting took place, but the reasons behind the original ratting, were thoroughly discredited. Giving Don an infraction for providing a community service, substantiating a warning placed on the warnings forum, seemed to be a little immature. I could go on; there are many more, but I hope these two examples serve sufficiently to get my point across.

Today however, the rage grew so great, that while preparing to post an outline of moderators relationship with their mothers, and farm animals, which no doubt would have gotten me at least infracted ( more likely banned ), the rage passed over and was replaced with pity. I realise that these people, have lost the confidence, and respect of the user base, keep going none the less, and how difficult this must be. Indeed I recall many occasions, of the moderator informing us of how difficult the job was. I can only imagine this job would be easier, if they earned, and were allowed to earn the support and respect of the community.

Before continuing allow me to clarify two things. Firstly, I'm not criticising the rules. They are needed to serve a very important purpose - just not the purpose they're serving now. The mods on this site enforce the rules, as I'm sure they've been instructed to by management, and this I believe is the crux of the problem. Mods need to enforce good order, and justice, using the rules as a tool to achieve this, and management need to trust their intelligence to do that, or find more intelligent moderators.

Secondly, I'm not criticising the moderators either - since they all, seem to behave in the same manner ( presumably to achieve some sterile form of "consistency" - what's the point in being consistently wrong? ), I'm assuming this iron-fisted, infallible rule book, has been handed down by management. I'm sure thehighwayman knows as well as I do, that there was nothing wrong with the Irish Translator thread ( considering that everything said in Irish, was a translation of something previously said in English ), but was bound by the rules to shut it down.

I am however criticising the management ( isn't that what management is for? ), since no matter what, that's where the buck stops. Even if they do decide on Monday to allow the Irish Translation thread, they've fostered, and allowed to grow, an environment where a thread can be stopped by a rule-book, without any application of common sense, and where the moderators get the backlash, disrespect, and ill-will that comes from this environment.

Fair enough. The main problem here though is that there is far too much focus on the 'cock ups' rather than the improvements, help and good customer service we provide. You said it yourself, "I am critising the management ( isn't that what management is for? )", which really does sum up the attitude really. Management aren't there to be critisied, but are there to try and resolve issues. If you read my response to the Irish Translation thread, you will see common sense has been applied, hence the reasons for the rule.

I always say 'You can't please everyone'. As managers, we are always at 'the care' stage, and this to me represents the epitome of negativity towards the management, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[Violette]

Fair enough. The main problem here though is that there is far too much focus on the 'cock ups' rather than the improvements, help and good customer service we provide. You said it yourself, "I am critising the management ( isn't that what management is for? )", which really does sum up the attitude really. Management aren't there to be critisied, but are there to try and resolve issues. If you read my response to the Irish Translation thread, you will see common sense has been applied, hence the reasons for the rule.

I always say 'You can't please everyone'. As managers, we are always at 'the care' stage, and this to me represents the epitome of negativity towards the management, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Sam these are not the opinions of random people without a vested interested in this community, these are the opinions of members who have been around a while, we have seen the fights the good times and the bad times. To simply dismiss that there is no validity in the opinions proffered here is slightly belittling. I as a non-member of the management put forth a possible solution to what really isn't a problem at all, if it were handled with compassion and reason you wouldn't be having these lengthy discussion about the effectiveness of the management. There is an US vs THEM mentality, and until that is over come, the management will forever having to put out these needless little brush fires.

[samlad]

Sam these are not the opinions of random people without a vested interested in this community, these are the opinions of members who have been around a while, we have seen the fights the good times and the bad times. To simply dismiss that there is no validity in the opinions proffered here is slightly belittling. I as a non-member of the management put forth a possible solution to what really isn't a problem at all, if it were handled with compassion and reason you wouldn't be having these lengthy discussion about the effectiveness of the management. There is an US vs THEM mentality, and until that is over come, the management will forever having to put out these needless little brush fires.

And I appreciate your comments. Thank you.