Where do we have 1.3bn to give to Greece ??

[Quarterpoundher]

Has the idea that maybe they're just making it all up struck anyone else.....?

I don't think organisations such as the IMF are easliy fooled.

[lordjohn]

That's the short term view, we took from the EU for far longer then we gave, its swings and roundabouts and we are a matured EU state now and the EU pumped a lot of money in here when we were a basket case for decades and regardless of our current problems we have to pay whatever share we signed up for. I am sure we have gotten far more from the EU then we have paid in and as we mature we become net contributors just as other nations were to us, we can't stay as a handout nation forever and have to honour our commitments or the whole house of cards falls apart.

Maybe that house of cards deserves to collapse but at the moment its what has stopped this continent from the cycle of wars that it was locked into and that alone makes paying a few billion well worth it, cheap at 100 times the price and what goes around comes around and it might be us getting bailed out before long.

Lets not look at the EU through rose tinted glasses here.
Granted in the early years we did get money from the EU tio bring our economy and standard of living up, but the money was handed over on the basis that when the Irish became more wealthy that we would begin to buy more and more goods made by the bigger European economies, that was evidenced during the boom years with more German BMW's, Mercs etc.
Also for the last 10 years or so Ireland has been a nett contributor to the EU, so we have been giving in a lot more than we have been taken out.
The Euros and possibly the EU's days are numbered as the two will implode.

(1) The Euro, 40% of Germans want to pull out of the Euro that poll was taken several weeks ago before the full cost of the Greek bailout was announced at 120Bn, Germany now has to pump in 80bn. This is really like a finger in the dike as Spain will be next, will Germany fork out hunereds of billions to prop up another basket case economy, or will they say fuck you lads I'm outta here.

(2) The EU will possibly implode soon after or if not implode the richer states, Germany, UK and France will form a higher EU and leave the knackery countries to fend for themselves, you can include Ireland in this club.

[lordjohn]

1.3 is a small amount to have to pay to help a country in need of assistance. If the shoe was on the other foot, we wouldn't be turning down the bailout now would we.

Mr Magooo I know you are coming off the cigs so I'll take it easy.

1.3bn is what we were cutting from the public service pay bill, this has resulted in strikes, go slows, passports not being issued etc.
We have also cut social welfare, health, dental treatment etc, etc
1.3bn is not a small amount if you have to borrow it yourself to give it + you may as well bring it to the hill of tara and light a bonfire with it as pour it into a basket case that is Greece

[Quarterpoundher]

Lets not look at the EU through rose tinted glasses here.
Granted in the early years we did get money from the EU tio bring our economy and standard of living up, but the money was handed over on the basis that when the Irish became more wealthy that we would begin to buy more and more goods made by the bigger European economies, that was evidenced during the boom years with more German BMW's, Mercs etc.
Also for the last 10 years or so Ireland has been a nett contributor to the EU, so we have been giving in a lot more than we have been taken out.
The Euros and possibly the EU's days are numbered as the two will implode.

(1) The Euro, 40% of Germans want to pull out of the Euro that poll was taken several weeks ago before the full cost of the Greek bailout was announced at 120Bn, Germany now has to pump in 80bn. This is really like a finger in the dike as Spain will be next, will Germany fork out hunereds of billions to prop up another basket case economy, or will they say fuck you lads I'm outta here.

(2) The EU will possibly implode soon after or if not implode the richer states, Germany, UK and France will form a higher EU and leave the knackery countries to fend for themselves, you can include Ireland in this club.

I am not looking at it with rose glasses at all. It makes total pragmatic cold and clinical economic self interested sense to aide a country to full economic health and have at some point get back your (The EU in this case) investment back with interest, in the context of the EU structural funds for Ireland that return is then plowed into building up our recent East European members and they in turn will become net contributors and we all have a larger pool of potential customers and potential for growth, another less tangible return for investing in countries is that successful countries tend to also become healthy democracies and less inclined to go to war with each other when all in the one bed and co dependent on each other. No matter what the price of bailing out Greece may be it is pittance compared to what a failed country can give rise to.

The EU has its faults but its core values have served over 320 million very well and if only looked at in pure economic terms it is a win win situation for all to be a part of it.

[lordjohn]

in the context of the EU structural funds for Ireland that return is then plowed into building up our recent East European members and they in turn will become net contributors and we all have a larger pool of potential customers and potential for growth,
.

Personally I do hope things work out well but history shows that empires always fall apart the EU being an empire of sorts.
I was reading an interesting article a while back and it was saying that a lot of people in the new states are disillusioned with the EU. Why ?
Because they are getting very little funds to build up their countries, because with 12 former soviet eastern block countries looking for funding there is very little to go around.
Thats another reason for the imploding of the EU it has expanded too quickly, without the resourses to back up the expansion.

[Westsidex]

Personally I do hope things work out well but history shows that empires always fall apart the EU being an empire of sorts.
I was reading an interesting article a while back and it was saying that a lot of people in the new states are disillusioned with the EU. Why ?
Because they are getting very little funds to build up their countries, because with 12 former soviet eastern block countries looking for funding there is very little to go around.
Thats another reason for the imploding of the EU it has expanded too quickly, without the resourses to back up the expansion.

the rich countries will get richer while the rest stay the same. Your post is bang on. There will never be a proper balance of power in the EU.

Westside.