Israel

[Marko1980]

I wonder will the Israeli ground invasion start tomorrow morning, exactly one week after the Hamas terrorist attack? They seem to be ready now, they absolutely have to go into Gaza, eliminate Hamas and attempt to rescue the hostages. It will be very bloody, but like a cancer, you have to get rid of it all, not just some of it.

If I read this right, they will be murdering civilians as they murder the terrorists but this is ok because it's like cancer removal procedure? Is that your take.
Even Leo Varadkar is saying Israel should not move ahead with this approach. Imagine having a more extreme view than him on this

[Stephanie]

There is a story going around that Hamas had beheaded babies. Biden said he had seen pictures of this.
The IDF have since said that the story of beheaded babies has no substance and there is no evidence of it.
The White House has since come out and clarified that Biden hadn't actually seen any pictures of beheaded babies.
But it is too late the story is out and is been circulated widely on social media.
This is propaganda in full effect and it is been perpetuated by the president of America.

Hi xx

For context >>

A Tel Aviv based female journalist claimed to have spoken to an Israeli Defense Force soldier who

supposedly told her witnessing “40 beheaded babies” .

Follow up journalists , Israeli military personnel and investigation have found No evidence of any such soldier

or evidence of any such event .

That Tel Aviv based lone female journalist is the sole source of this ‘news’ - which has been denied

by All entities .

[Marko1980]

So babies heads weren't cut off? Ah that's ok then. So the fact they were just killed in their cots and mutilated by Hamas terrorists is not as bad.

Jesus, give me patience. 🙄

The point here is that the lie of babies being beheaded is pure propaganda, to justify the mass murder thats now happening and will continue to happen.
The point is to paint them as animals/savages so they can axt the same.
Article from CNN here where the Israeli government themselves admit to such, so its important not to spread misinformation. Facts are important.
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/10/12/m...ntl/index.html

Also, im not sure if you know what bombs do to babies, its not a nice peaceful death anyway.
No children should be killed and Hamas have done some vile things.
You seem to have expressed no issue with Israel exacting this on Palestinians though, your view seems really one sided.

I find it hard to get my head around people who think about this politically.
If you cant empathise with whats happened to both Israeli civilians and Palestinian ones then you might want to have a look for your humanity.

[Rachel Divine]

International media were allowed in to see the aftermath of the massacre. Footage of houses smashed, burnt and blood everywhere. Children's bedrooms had blood everywhere even up the walls. House after house. Village after village. Survivor eyewitness accounts. They even got footage off dashcams showing hamass throwing hand grenades into civilian shelters, blowing people to bits. What news do you watch? The images of the dead kids too graphic to show on mainstream news. Lots of footage on Twitter if you want to see it. Are you saying all of the world's media conspired to lie? Seriously?????

Media will tell what is allowed to say. Simple.

[Rachel Divine]

This is a sensitive subject.

Respectful discourse is paramount.

Differing views are welcome, but keep it civil, this means no provocations and no hate speech.

Please be aware that we are committed to maintaining a respectful environment, and measures will be taken accordingly.

Who is your post aimed at?

[Rooney2808]

So babies heads weren't cut off? Ah that's ok then. So the fact they were just killed in their cots and mutilated by Hamas terrorists is not as bad.

Jesus, give me patience. 🙄

Nobody said that what happened was OK.
Hopefully Jesus does give you patience, the patience to read something properly, take the time to digest it and then respond in kind.

[Stephanie]

Just reading - Tik Tok, Twitter, Facebook - well, all social media, been told to watch out for ''fake news'' '' content pro terrorists'' - meaning - UE wants people to be informed only of what they say it is okay the people to know.

How is that informations, facts, no fake news, and more important, truth?!

Also, I am not familiar with that part of the world, but I hear Muslims do not kill women, children and babies, due to their religion. Maybe someone knows better than I do?!

Unfortunately they Do .

Not to derail This thread , but unfortunately their religion does not preclude them from committing the

most atrocious , vile , horrendous things not only against the ‘infidels’ ( :: anybody and everybody

who is not Muslim ) , but also against their own Muslim brothers and sisters , against innocent children ;

During the height of the Iraq - Syria Islamic State reign ( and ISIS’ rise to power and rule ) they crucified

innumerable fellow Muslims , took sex slaves as ‘property’ ( those women , children abused in the most

unspeakable ways ! ) ;

they burned a Jordanian pilot alive : doused him in gasoline , locked him in a metal cage in a square , and lit him .

Women have suffered the Worst under their rule and occupation .

Also take Afghanistan , and the Taliban :: their treatment of women and girls is atrocious .

It can be argued that the above two examples are more of a Cultural nature and less of religious teachings -

- and religion was merely cynically used to get and to hold onto Power - , but it so happens that both of those ‘powers’

are / were Islamic .


: Not all Muslim people would do such things . The majority of Muslim people want only the things

that any other person would : peace , job , living wage , raise a family , educate their children .

They’re just people like any of us .

BUT , there are factions whose aim is to destroy All ‘infidels’ - and they will and Do use any method possible .


Saying all that : in This conflict there’s no mercy shown by other side either .

I’m watching / reading reports coming out from both sides : if you don’t read the caption which side

the report is from - from Israel or from Gaza - , you wouldn’t be able to tell whence it had come from ::

:: the suffering is equal , the heartache , the terror , the loss on a human level - Equal .


It’s the politicians and power-grabbers , power players in the back that I’d string up .

Playing political / economic world chess games : playing with peoples’ lives and futures / or lack thereof .

Despicable .



………

Also Rache , Hamas is Muslim . They attacked Israel and killed indiscriminately: women , children , etc.

[Airbusdriver]

People are missing a lot of points here. The international media were allowed into the villages to view the aftermath of the attacks by Hamas on the civilians. The likes of CNN, BBC, Al Jazeera, France 24, were all there. They interviewed the handful of survivors. They interviewd the man from Dublin whose little girl was executed. Do people seriously think such a wide mix of international media would conspire to lie? It's very easy to be sarcastic and say that the media are saying what they are told to say. That's simply untrue. That's like what Hamas terrorists would try to say as part of their propaganda machine.

[IAmLIAm]

First off let me apologize to all of whom I have placed upon a pox by giving a "thanks". Surly the other side will now give you no quarter and I've doomed you to a life of solitary suffering.

Again, this is a very nuanced topic and I'm glad to see that the conversation has opened up a bit to allow some fact based, logical discussion (I probably lacked the tact, or rep, to help move it along. Or maybe I'm just an easy target since I'm so low on the totem pole, like Airbus). However, the things I still pick up on are some of the flawed logic chains.

The view point that Hamas didn't kill women and children because YOU didn't see it is like saying the terror attacks didn't happen because YOU didn't see it (all green-screened CGI) or that the mistreatment of Palestinians doesn't happen because YOU don't see it (must be a film set in Tunisia). Conspiracy theories are little more than propaganda themselves. You think the global news outlets (with varying levels of their own deferent biases) conspired to tell a fairly similar story. Have you ever told 10 people a secret? It would take about 6 hours for 50 more to know your business (and as individuals we hold no significance to half those people). We all understand that if we lived in squaller and violence and food insecurity we'd be all for the revolution, but can you not see that if your neighbors were brutalized and your children massacred you'd also want vengeance? I'm not saying that you need to agree with both sides (where we each fall is going to be determined by our individual experiences as it relates to each matter) but how can we hope to find a solution if you don't, at least try to, understand the other side (or do you just want to "win")?

Even when you present good arguments if you throw in an anti-Semitic dog whistle, or convoluted conspiracy, or defensive barb, or paint with broad strokes you are undermining yourself. That's why I seek clarity (sometimes in a manner more provocatively then I ought to) for better understanding. If you question my intent or position feel free to reply or message me if you'd rather be discreet. I don't mind an open, honest conversation involving differing oppinions.

[Marko1980]

First off let me apologize to all of whom I have placed upon a pox by giving a "thanks". Surly the other side will now give you no quarter and I've doomed you to a life of solitary suffering.

Again, this is a very nuanced topic and I'm glad to see that the conversation has opened up a bit to allow some fact based, logical discussion (I probably lacked the tact, or rep, to help move it along. Or maybe I'm just an easy target since I'm so low on the totem pole, like Airbus). However, the things I still pick up on are some of the flawed logic chains.

The view point that Hamas didn't kill women and children because YOU didn't see it is like saying the terror attacks didn't happen because YOU didn't see it (all green-screened CGI) or that the mistreatment of Palestinians doesn't happen because YOU don't see it (must be a film set in Tunisia). Conspiracy theories are little more than propaganda themselves. You think the global news outlets (with varying levels of their own deferent biases) conspired to tell a fairly similar story. Have you ever told 10 people a secret? It would take about 6 hours for 50 more to know your business (and as individuals we hold no significance to half those people). We all understand that if we lived in squaller and violence and food insecurity we'd be all for the revolution, but can you not see that if your neighbors were brutalized and your children massacred you'd also want vengeance? I'm not saying that you need to agree with both sides (where we each fall is going to be determined by our individual experiences as it relates to each matter) but how can we hope to find a solution if you don't, at least try to, understand the other side (or do you just want to "win")?

Even when you present good arguments if you throw in an anti-Semitic dog whistle, or convoluted conspiracy, or defensive barb, or paint with broad strokes you are undermining yourself. That's why I seek clarity (sometimes in a manner more provocatively then I ought to) for better understanding. If you question my intent or position feel free to reply or message me if you'd rather be discreet. I don't mind an open, honest conversation involving differing oppinions.

I presume youre not directing this at me.
I never said children werent murdered by Hamas, they were and brutally.
And theories that Israel allowed this happen is a "9/11 was an inside job" stuff. In reality they may have received intelligence but didnt act or disregarded its validity.

And there are no anti-semitic undertones from me.

Wanting revenge is a pretty natural response to what has happened but the role of a state is to not break international law by retaliating in kind. They have an obligation as a democratic state to act within the boundaries of international law.
Im not trying to win an argument, my point is just a humanitarian one.

Netanyahu is a far right racist, and he is taking a hot steamy shit on any reputation Israel might have had internationally as a civilised entity.
Varadkar has condemned collective reprisal, Norway have done the same today and as the days unfold more nations will. Wait and see.

And theres no totem poles here, if Airbus had an opinion that wasnt siding with ethnic cleansing, a lot more people would agree with him.