Laura Lee high court challange

[justfrank44]

The dogs in the street know Sinn Fein/IRA are all the one, who do you think you are talking to?

The DUP as fair as I know never had an armed wing. Now it would be fair to say Sinn Fein are still taking orders from the army council, ask any volunteer.

" ff and fg's civil war roots" Your having a laugh going back to the civil war, you sound like a shinner to me.

Let me remind you of the last person SF/IRA murdered.

Kevin McGuigan Sr, who was a former member of the Provisional IRA on 13 August 2015.

What did I say about murdering members of their own community?

jesus you really do have issues don't you.Sinn fein and the ira were two parts of the republician movement, not one and the same. Show me please where they take orders from the army council, or is that what you call their ard fheis? You seem to have double standards too, ff and fg were founded from the ira , ie, parties that used violence to achieve their goals, how is that different from your view of sinn fein? Want something more current? what about the labour parties links to the official ira?
As for kevin mcguigan, if I remember correctly, the chief constable said that while he was shot by members of the ira, it was not sanctioned by the army council.
I am not a shinner as you call them, but I hate this lazy attitude of throwaway comments to make you look good on a website, very poor.

[justfrank44]

Sinn Féin is the largest Irish republican political party and was closely associated with the Provisional IRA, with the Irish Government alleging that senior members of Sinn Féin have held posts on the IRA Army Council. However, the SF leadership has denied these claims.

The US Government has made similar allegations.
A republican document of the early 1980s stated: "Both Sinn Féin and the IRA play different but converging roles in the war of national liberation. The Irish Republican Army wages an armed campaign... Sinn Féin maintains the propaganda war and is the public and political voice of the movement".

The British Government stated in 2005 that "we had always said all the way through we believed that Sinn Féin and the IRA were inextricably linked and that had obvious implications at leadership level". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinn_F%C3%A9in


"You seem to have double standards too, ff and fg were founded from the ira , ie, parties that used violence to achieve their goals, how is that different from your view of sinn fein?"

Nearly every organisation in the state has it origins with the IRA. And to keep harping on about the civil war to justify present SF/IRA murderers that are running for election at the moment is just crass in the extreme.

"Want something more current? what about the labour parties links to the official ira?"

Last time I checked the OIRA didn't engage in sectarian violence and wanted to unite all Irish men and women against British rule & not be exclusive to one tradition.

"As for kevin mcguigan, if I remember correctly, the chief constable said that while he was shot by members of the ira, it was not sanctioned by the army council.

And the provos are now going rouge! Do you not think that statement was politically motivated as SF/IRA are still how many years later and how many murderers walking free are still threatening the peace process, or did you forget the political fallout.

As I said in the first part of my last post, sinn fein and the ira are/were two parts of the republican movement, you must have missed that bit. As for members of sinn fein being on the army council, I have yet to see any proof, pedantic I know, but I'm funny like that. Very easy to throw around allegations without proof.

You wrote"Nearly every organisation in the state has it origins with the IRA. And to keep harping on about the civil war to justify present SF/IRA murderers that are running for election at the moment is just crass in the extreme." So those parties are to be excused their connections with a violent organisation but sinn fein are to be held to different standards? Two faced much?
The oira engaged in murder, surely that is the only criteria needed for exclusion by your rules.
As for your last line, what exactly do you think the political fallout would have been? It wouldn't have hurt sinn fein in the slightest. The party to suffer would have been the dup as westminister would have been forced to take control ( not by choice ) and then the north would have been run more along uk lines which the dup would hate. No chance of flags flying, same sex marriages allowed, blood donations from the gay community etc.


I am not trying to change your mind about sinn fein by the way, I just get tired of seeing the same tired old cliches being used to attack them and the other parties being let of lightly, when they are guilty of more recent crimes.

[justfrank44]

justfrank44, I cant help but feel that any further discourse with you an the matter is futile & will just raise my blood pressure.

"You wrote"Nearly every organisation in the state has it origins with the IRA. And to keep harping on about the civil war to justify present SF/IRA murderers that are running for election at the moment is just crass in the extreme." So those parties are to be excused their connections with a violent organisation but sinn fein are to be held to different standards? Two faced much?"


Let's start by Gerry Adams telling the truth about his membership in the PIRA, two faced much?

But surely you can appreciate that none of the civil war veterans are trying to rule my country now? they are all long dead!!

And I might add I take great offence with the comparisons you are making with Arthur Griffith's Sinn Fein & the trotskyite views of OIRA with the sectarian
murderers & the apologists of SF.

What exactly is the truth, because no one has been able to make that allegation stick. But to be honest I don't care wether he was or wasn/t , And again another ham fisted approach to attacking sinn fein. Given that the dup, the uu the british government, american government, ff, fg and lab are willing to work with adams, it make his past associations pretty irrelevant. I am sure that ff and fg would claim their origins also lie with Arthur Griffiths sinn fein but you don't seem to concerned with what they have done with his legacy.

[justfrank44]

Have you read Sinn Fein's manifesto they are nuts!

"I'd say vote independent where possible."

I was tempted to vote independent but all of them in my area said they can do business with SF (Who are the biggest threat to our democracy ever faced by this state.) & will given the chance (Special interests I guess.)

"An that fella having a dig at Mary Lou was an obvious plant."

Agreed, but her reaction was telling.

Discussing his points calmly and reasonably, yes it was very telling. Also he was a bit of a muppet saying that he would vote fg because they have usc, only for mary lou to point out that fg are getting rid of usc to the tune of 4 billion. It is sinn fein that are keeping it for highr earners.

Sinn fein are the biggest threat to democracy? would you ever catch yourself on.

[justfrank44]

Your showing your compete ignorance now or as your a member of the Gerry, SF cult I think you have blinkers on.

Read today's Sunday Independant: Revelations by Dr Susan Phoenix.

But then again you don't beleave the Irish government, the Americans or the British.

"Given that the dup, the uu the british government, american government, ff, fg and lab are willing to work with adams"

To stop him and his cohorts killing people and causing millions of pounds worth of damage!

Anyway surely democracy is the only way & not the gun?

I do genuinely applaud Gerry Adams move away from the armalite but they are not fit to rule this country as far as I'm concerned, not yet anyway.

Lets have some truth first.

I think you are confusing yourself here, I think for myself and you can't handle that.

It is well seeing that you are quoting the indo. A paper that will print complete shite about sinn fein without bothering to fact check. You really are having a laugh now. I don't think even fg or ff supporters take it seriously.

[Wolverine]

Have you read Sinn Fein's manifesto they are nuts!

"I'd say vote independent where possible."

I was tempted to vote independent but all of them in my area said they can do business with SF (Who are the biggest threat to our democracy ever faced by this state.) & will given the chance (Special interests I guess.)

"An that fella having a dig at Mary Lou was an obvious plant."

Agreed, but her reaction was telling.

I think FF,FG and labour completely ignored the democratic view of the people when they allowed and supported a second referendum for the Lisbon treaty.
FF has links to the IRA too. Remember Charles J Haughey gun running. M.Martin shouldn't mention republican violence at all.
Independents will get my vote. The ruling parties need to get the message - you can't go back on your word and get re-elected.

[justfrank44]

Wrong. You are entitled to your views and beleave it or not I enjoy talking to you.

"It is well seeing that you are quoting the indo. A paper that will print complete shite about sinn fein without bothering to fact check."

Good man did you get that quote from An Phoblacht?

Have you been reading the stories the indo has printed? Do you think they are good journalism? Did you like the 10 reasons not to vote for sinn fein where the mistakes started in the first line?

[justfrank44]

justfrank44, I don't need any news paper to tell me anything about SF/IRA I have been surrounded by them all my life.

You quoted the indo as a source and then accussed me of being led by an phoblacht, by the way I haven't even seen it in years. I was just pointing out the reliability of the indo. And I don't think you have been surrounded by them as much as I have to be fair, which is why I have a wee smile at your " disgust"

[justfrank44]

Agreed. You have my sympathies. I got away from them. I mean they lost the war. Are taking the Queens shilling & seem to have a very special contempt for us in the Republic (sorry fee state to the shinners which they have so much contempt for. Yet want to govern us.)

The mind boggles at the duplicity of them!!

You do seem far up there ass & you seem to like it because your a prooganda tool for them!

Is that the best you can do? I don't need sympathy, I have had a fairly good life here, any problems did not come from the ira, loyalists, british army yes.Lost the war? That didn't make the news , do show me a link.
I neither work for, nor canvas for sinn fein. To be honest, this is the only place I actually post about them, you do make it easy for me though

[justfrank44]

Agreed, but do you think Gerry Adams shares our common experience in this Republic? Our highs & lows?

We are just fee stater's, sure they have said as much 1000 times and again I ask are they fit to govern us?

How many political leaders share the voters common experience? I would say Gerry has probably had a harder life than most, given where he grew up, police and army harassment , murder attempt, family problems et al. I don't have sympathy for him, nor do I think he is very charismatic as a leader, but it is hard to argue with his political record.
As far as are they fit to govern? To be fair , if and when it happens, it will not be easy for them for several reasons. Firstly , relative inexperience, secondly a volatile world economy, a huge personal debt sitting at an average of 44, 000 euro per citizen. But their economic policiy is reportedly the most prudent of all the parties, focusing on helping the less well off. But given the inability of the other parties to run the country, why shouldn't sinn fein have their day? Look on the bright side, if they fuck it up, they will not get another chance for a very long time.