Infractions. Should things be changed?

[westcorklad]

Fair enough Mark I see your point. But I do not see much difference between the Mods and managers, and as I said, they work so closely together they rarely seem to overrule one another.
The broader point is that I do not know of any proceedure of sanctions that does not have some appeals process.
If you apply for TR and are refused you can appeal it, why not infractions and bans?

Why not start a poll on whether this is a good idea or not and see what the response to it is?

[westcorklad]

What's the structure here anyway ? I always assumed the managers and mods were not located in Ireland. I reasoned that this was for legal reasons, whereby the site is not hosted in Ireland so makes it difficult to shut down if ever any Irish legal challenge were made against it. I'm no expert in the field at all, but this is why I'd imagine Irish resident members probably could not become in any way associated with the management of the site.

The managers are located in the UK however the mods(or at least some of them )are here in Ireland.

[anon361]

If nothing else clear instructions that are easily accessible on how to appeal an infraction should be added to the site, I've looked and nowhere does it say what rights you have to appeal one of the managers or mods decisions. I know Patricia has stated many times that if you are not happy you can contact her but with so many members and so many decisions that are questioned I don't think contacting her for every whim would be possible.
I've never recieved an infraction () but surely when you recieve a PM informing you of your infraction advice is given as to how you can appeal it

[Sam Spade]

Fair enough Mark I see your point. But I do not see much difference between the Mods and managers, and as I said, they work so closely together they rarely seem to overrule one another.
The broader point is that I do not know of any proceedure of sanctions that does not have some appeals process.
If you apply for TR and are refused you can appeal it, why not infractions and bans?

I believe a system should be set in place to allow the appeal of infractions and bans.
I do however think this should be done in-house, between the managers and mods.
They should provide feedback to the individual stating their reasons why or why not they uphold the ban or infraction.

Organisations are bureaucratic enough without adding another layer to the tier.
Again, just my thoughts.

[dannyboy10]

If nothing else clear instructions that are easily accessible on how to appeal an infraction should be added to the site, I've looked and nowhere does it say what rights you have to appeal one of the managers or mods decisions. I know Patricia has stated many times that if you are not happy you can contact her but with so many members and so many decisions that are questioned I don't think contacting her for every whim would be possible.
I've never recieved an infraction () but surely when you recieve a PM informing you of your infraction advice is given as to how you can appeal it

No you are not informed of an appeal. And usually (or maybe just in my case ) if you argue you are told they are not getting into a debate. Push it and you are looking at another infraction. That is the annoying part, the dismissive attitude sometime (not all) and not being able to reasonably put you case forward.

[dannyboy10]

I believe a system should be set in place to allow the appeal of infractions and bans.
I do however think this should be done in-house, between the managers and mods.
They should provide feedback to the individual stating their reasons why or why not they uphold the ban or infraction.

Organisations are bureaucratic enough without adding another layer to the tier.
Again, just my thoughts.

An appeal process would not be seen to be fair if those deciding on it are the people that banned or infracted you in the first place.
Besides if you are banned you have no way to contact anyone as your pm is shut off straight away!

I can see about the layers in an organiszation but is it not better for the community to have more imput into these matters.
Besides it would be two layers. Those that enforce the rules and an appeals board and that would be it.

I do not think in house as you put it works as despite best efforts it would not be seen to be impartial.

[Sam Spade]

I believe a system should be set in place to allow the appeal of infractions and bans.
I do however think this should be done in-house, between the managers and mods.
They should provide feedback to the individual stating their reasons why or why not they uphold the ban or infraction.

Organisations are bureaucratic enough without adding another layer to the tier.
Again, just my thoughts.

Further to this. If an appeals committee was set up amongst ordinary posters, just think of the infighting and allegations of cliques etc. Would be a minefield at best, and possibly downright destructive at worst.

An appeals procedure should be removed one step away from the posters.

[dannyboy10]

Further to this. If an appeals committee was set up amongst ordinary posters, just think of the infighting and allegations of cliques etc. Would be a minefield at best, and possibly downright destructive at worst.

An appeals procedure should be removed one step away from the posters.

I agree the most difficult part would be selecting the right people but the likes of El Gordo and Anon I think among others would be more than fair.

[vampirejackie]

There are rules on the site, which need to be kept to. If you break them you will get a warning / infraction / ban depending on the particular incident. We have guidelines that we work to , to ensure conisistency in the application of these. There are always exceptions as you can never cover every possible scenario that may happen.
I think there needs to be a bit of a reality check here...its a message board!!!!
I do think some of you take this all far to seriously. Its supposed to be a place where people can have fun, ask questions, have a bit of banter, and occasionally someone kicks off and we have to deal with it.
Yes, i agree for escorts who pay to advertise on this site, the consequences of an infraction or ban may be different for them.

There is no official appeal process, but you can email / PM in relation to an infraction etc. We have in the past reversed decisions and removed them, if it was felt that a wrong decision was made, so its not true that decisions cant get reversed. They can under the right circumstances.

I feel this thread is all in response to two people who arent happy about infractions they were given, and they didnt get them reversed.

[Forrest]

Sorry Dannyboy but I think this is a non runner.The managers and mods are the only people with the authority to reverse infractions and this proposed appeals board would undermine that authority.
Besides who would decide who would be appropriate members?

I am in agreement WCL.
When members were appointed as moderators, it was done with the intention of having some form of balance - non E-I personnel who would have a better understanding of the members being moderated. Now they are considered 'one of them', which is unfair.
Overall, I think that it has worked but there will always be occasions where personalities clash, and rash decisions are made. I have seen bans reversed, in the past, in the cold light of day, so I am sure it is possible to remove an infraction in the same way.

The rules are there for all to see and it's up to the members and escorts to accept them or just stay away from the boards.
What happens if the appeals panel do not overturn an infraction - they are then accused of siding with management. Threads will always be started and arguments will ensue when someone popular is banned or infracted. I know Shirleyy was annoyed last night for receiving a 2nd infraction, and probably still is, but she hasn't been banned, and will hopefully continue posting, so no real harm done.

Mods and managers are human and are only doing their job based on the rules in place.
Remember the old phrase "You can catch more flies with honey rather than vinegar"