Focus on Ruhama

[MrFussy]

Mr. Fussy, you've written 108 reviews in the space of less than 2 years........the good boys and girls of Ruhama would probably have you castrated if they could get their hands on you.

I know I and other punters are a subject of their efforts.

At simple face value, Ruhama are whiter than white.

But in this world you have to look beyond the image of themselves that organisations like Ruhama create and see what is really behind the PR facade.

I'd challenge anyone to really look into Ruhama and then come back here and defend them.

I can fully understand that most people would look at Ruhama on the face of it and imagine they do good work, but scratch the surface and it's a whole different story.

Let's not get into looking beyond the facade or scratching the surface. I imagine EI would not advocate that either. Ruhama has a different and opposite agenda to EI, at least cutting out trafficking is a common goal. They have their objectives and you have yours, all I am saying is that these views will always be polar opposites. EI make a lot of money from this site, I spend a lot of money on activities advertised on this site, neither of us are whiter that white...so I dare say we should not denegrate the Ruhama organisation...

[nicegirlsarenice]

E-I isn't degenerating into anything. Ruhama are a load of bullshit and that's the end of it.

E-I's objectives are mainly the same objectives Ruhama says it has to the media.

[Doozer]

I think the point that is being made here is that Ruhama are not being true to themselves. They are basically saying that all escorts are forced into doing this job. Which they are not, I think most of us can agree with that. Obviously if anyone is forced into prostitution they should be arrested and brought to trial and let justice be done. But they want to name and shame those who have used these services is a bit ridiculous. The mud slinging goes back and forth each from each side hides the true value form each group. In theroy what Ruhama does is good and benificial but in reality it does seem to be a pr stunt gone wrong making them out to be like Mother Teresa to all the neglected woman forced into prostitution by and I quote 'We see prostitution and the social and cultural attitudes which sustain it as being deeply rooted in gender inequality and social marginalisation. ' , meaning at the hands of immoral men

[Patricia]

Let's not get into looking beyond the facade or scratching the surface. I imagine EI would not advocate that either. Ruhama has a different and opposite agenda to EI, at least cutting out trafficking is a common goal. They have their objectives and you have yours, all I am saying is that these views will always be polar opposites. EI make a lot of money from this site, I spend a lot of money on activities advertised on this site, neither of us are whiter that white...so I dare say we should not denegrate the Ruhama organisation...

I am not arguing that E-I is whiter than white. You don't claim to be whiter than white either. But this discussion isn't about E-I or you - it is about Ruhama - so lets stay on topic.

Ruhama are entitled to their opinions of course. I don't object to them holding the opinions they do. (I do object to the lying they do, but that's not even my core problem with Ruhama.)

I think it is very wrong that all the funding for help for sex workers in this country seems to be going to Ruhama and being spent on PR to forward their personal Catholic anti-prostitution agenda.

I'd like to see the money made available by the HSE, the Probation and Welfare Service, the Commission for Support of Victims of Crime, the Dept. of Justice etc used to support sex workers, not spent on making videos demonising clients, spreading lies and calling for changes to the law that will make sex work more dangerous etc.

Go and look at Ruhama, go look how much they get and what they spend it on. I appreciate that people may glance over this thread and think I should show more respect, but I believe sex workers get a very raw deal in this country and I'd like to see them get a better one. Imagine the HSE etc funding went to an organisation that concentrated on helping women more so than PR? I had a dream...

[MrFussy]

E-I isn't degenerating into anything. Ruhama are a load of bullshit and that's the end of it.

E-I's objectives are mainly the same objectives Ruhama says it has to the media.

I think if you read my comments you will find I've lready stated that there is a common goal.
My reply, expressing my disappointment with this post, is that none of us can afford to take the moral high ground, or call into question the actions of others relating to the subject of prostitution, particularly with the financial vested interest, structures etc. in place to shield owners, benefactors and contributors on this site..

[carlos marvado]

I think the point that is being made here is that Ruhama are not being true to themselves. They are basically saying that all escorts are forced into doing this job. Which they are not, I think most of us can agree with that. Obviously if anyone is forced into prostitution they should be arrested and brought to trial and let justice be done. But they want to name and shame those who have used these services is a bit ridiculous. The mud slinging goes back and forth each from each side hides the true value form each group. In theroy what Ruhama does is good and benificial but in reality it does seem to be a pr stunt gone wrong making them out to be like Mother Teresa to all the neglected woman forced into prostitution by and I quote 'We see prostitution and the social and cultural attitudes which sustain it as being deeply rooted in gender inequality and social marginalisation. ' , meaning at the hands of immoral men

Well said Brother Doozer.

There are a few points about Ruhama that I find hypocritical and objectionable and which I would find insulting even if I were a woman.

Firstly, if you take the statistics that Ruhama produce regarding trafficked women/children or the number of such women/children that it has helped, there is a marked contrast between it's figures and those of the Gardai. Now there could be a number of reasons for this discrepancy: A) Differing definitions of what constitutes trafficking. Personally I would regard sex trafficking as being forcing or coercing a person to come here against their will for the purposes of prostitution or sexual exploitation, or bringing a person here or getting them to come here under false pretenses and once here, forcing them against their will to work in prostitution. I suspect that the Gardai may be using some definition along these lines, whereas Ruhama are using a much broader definition, which includes any person assisted in coming to Ireland by another person or other persons, even if this assistance only involves provision of information. (Remember the Right to Life Amendment and the Right To Travel and the Right to Information sections that we voted on years ago). B) Foreign prostitutes and escorts may be saying one thing to the Gardai and another to Ruhama, but one could argue, that they are more likely to tell the Gardai that they are being trafficked, whether this is actually true or false, in order to be treated more leniently. C) Ruhama cannot accept that any person would come here of their own free will to work as an escort and automatically record all foreign escorts as trafficked. This massaging of the figures enables Ruhama to paint a very one sided picture of reality which they can use to justify the "good" work that they do and keep the state departments/government agencies and their other sponsors on side. If this is the case, Ruhama would not be the first NGO to produce embellished statistics to justify their existence.

Secondly, given that Ruhama fail to acknowledge that a person could freely chose this type of work and must be exploited/trafficked, they are insulting escorts. They claim to be a Christian/Catholic NGO and my understanding of the Good Book, is that the God that they believe in, is supposed to have given us free will. Ruhama deny that escorts have free will (maybe because they view most of them as women being exploited by men) and view all as having been forced into this work. Indeed a lot of escorts probably are forced into this work by financial necessity, debts or poverty, but in a lot of other cases, it may be the attraction of making large sums of money quickly in order to rise above their current situation and set themselves up in life. Ruhama portray all escorts as victims, controlled and unable to make their own life choices for themselves, and when they do encounter a strong, independent and articulate escort, they invariably look for another reason, such as an abusive childhood or relationship and/or low self esteem, to explain away why they are working as escorts. Ruhama act like some of the most extreme man-hating lesbian feminists out there, but what they forget, is that if they insist that women should have free will in terms of choices and over their own bodies, then they are complete hypocrites if they themselves try to limit a woman's free will or her sovereignty over her own body.

Thirdly, in my original post, I highlighted the involvement of both the religious congregations behind Ruhama in the running of Magdalene laundries, industrial schools and reformatories. In the case of Magdalene laundries, these were self financing, whereas the others were funded or part funded by the state on the basis of the number of "inmates" there. Apart from the many abuses which have been recorded in these institutions, the sheer material neglect of those being "cared" for and the forced labour in the workshops/factories or on the farms of these institutions, meant that in many, if not all cases the congregations running them were being financed by these arrangements and making a profit from them. In other words, many a nun, priest or brother led a nice comfortable existence on the backs of the suffering and forced labour of women and children. So for any religious congregation involved in these money making rackets to set itself up as a champion for the underprivileged, the abused, the trafficked or the exploited takes some degree of breath taking hypocrisy.

[Doozer]

If Ruhuma used the 'standerdised' version of what trafficing is they would loose money as their is , as the garda leave us believe only a small number of traffiked women arriving on our shores. This would mean Ruhuma would loose any government funding. Best way to combat this is to omove the goalposts and expand what being traffiked actually is. Any woman who is involved in prostitution must have been forced into this lifestyle as no one would willingly be involved in this way of life.

[Doozer]

Ruhuma on Capital D promoting new film traffic fast forward to 12 mins
RT

[Doozer]

Statement from Ruhama
21st May 2010*
The Film ‘Trafficked’ is a must see for those who wish to get an insight into a dark and abusive world
A new Irish film ‘Trafficked’ will be shown in several of our cinemas, starting today. *
This is an excellent film, as it recreates with remarkable skill, the reality for many women who have been trafficked in this country for the purpose of sexual exploitation. The producer and actors have created a world, which we in Ruhama are confronted with on a daily basis, as we assist trafficked women, who are beaten, abused and isolated in a most disturbing way. The film is set here in Dublin, as indeed are many of the women we assist.*
Gerardine Rowley, of Ruhama said today, “The film ‘Trafficked’ raises so many of the issues which are of concern to Ruhama; the physical and sexual abuse, the dreadful isolation and sense of helplessness, the subtlety of the initial stages of entrapment and the brutality of the traffickers when there is any semblance of resistance by the women”*
Gerardine Rowley went on to say, “The film of course also highlights the obvious fact that women would not be trafficked in the Irish sex trade, if there were not men readily available to use the services provided. One of our District Court Judges, Mr John Neilan, commenting after a court case into brothel keeping in Longford recently, said that ‘the quicker legislation is brought in to enable the publishing of the names and addresses of the people who avail of such services, then the better’. This proposed legislation should be explored further. If the threat of naming and shaming were the norm, fewer men would use the services and fewer women would be trafficked and abused”*
The Premier of the film, held earlier this week was in aid of Ruhama.*

[Smarty]

I've said it here before and I will say it again Ruhama is just a group of frustrated nuns, who would'nt get a ride off a priest.

Lets face it Ruhama was initially set up as an out reach project to help girls working the streets.

Lets face it the street action in Dublin has dropped alarmingly over the last 10 years.

With hardly anyone working the streets, they have had to reinvent themselves, to keep getting the generous Govt grants (when was the last time you seen a street collection for Ruhama), and keep themselves in plus offices.

Cue the Traffiked women who evil Irish men are abusing. They have exaggerated the problem totally.

In my personal experiences of visiting escorts over many the years I have yet to meet the "Frightened traffiked woman type" most of the girls are sound business women with a cheery disposition