Lisbon 2

[Mousey]

RTÉ News: Draft Lisbon guarantees revealed

Before summer's out we'll have to go to the polls again in another referendum, because we didn't give the correct answer last time around.

Should once have been enough? And will all these legal guarantees make any difference as to how people vote?


IMPORTANT: Please do NOT let this thread devolve into the specific issue of immigration and why some are for and some are against it. I'm referring here to Ireland's place in the world generally, and within our own political region (the EU) specifically.

[kieree]

im voting no again to piss off the scum that are currently in government

[Alec Horan]

as a matter of principal i would vote NO.


this has nothing to do with the content of the treaty.


reason being that we appear to be the only nation where the treaty is put to a popular vote and there would appear to be a lot of popular opposition to it.

i would not suggest that all laws require referenda but in this case i would have to say it is imperative.

surely this is absurd and undemocratic. democratic for us yes but until all nations are allowed a popular vote i believe it is wrong to push this thru.

we are also awaiting full ratification from the czechs/poles and germans. challenged in a german court - ruling at end of this month.

on a bit of a tangent here - i do admire the swiss style of democracy - a much more active type of democracy - a real and regular involvment of the states citizens

[thehighwayman]

Their wasting money and time having another Lisbon Treaty vote. It's only going to be no again and especially now. Why do they keep having this referndum untill they get a yes vite.

[Westsidex]

the priorities of the gov and opposition are headways up their arses.The priorities should lie with our economy.Lisbon can wait,we must sort out our country first.

how much more will it take for the Irish to grow balls?,
Westside.

[Westsidex]

as a matter of principal i would vote NO.


this has nothing to do with the content of the treaty.


reason being that we appear to be the only nation where the treaty is put to a popular vote and there would appear to be a lot of popular opposition to it.

i would not suggest that all laws require referenda but in this case i would have to say it is imperative.

surely this is absurd and undemocratic. democratic for us yes but until all nations are allowed a popular vote i believe it is wrong to push this thru.

we are also awaiting full ratification from the czechs/poles and germans. challenged in a german court - ruling at end of this month.

on a bit of a tangent here - i do admire the swiss style of democracy - a much more active type of democracy - a real and regular involvment of the states citizens

also have one of the best banking systems in the world.

Westside.

[thehighwayman]

That's enough politics for me. I'm off to watch rest of Questions & Answers

[wineher_dineher_69her]

Guys,

There are so many things i could write about this kind of discussion on this kind of "blog", mainly that it doesn't belong on an escort website!! Anyway, it's here so i may as well add my 2c...

To start with, i am not a supporter of the current Government, far from it actually. I have never voted for them and i never will and i honestly think that those that did last time round are fuckin eejits. However, that said, the vote for the Lisbon treaty should NOT be used as a way of telling the government that we are not happy with them. That is what we did in the local and european elections, and presumably the general election when it comes around.

The Lisbon Treaty is about Europe, and us going forward within Europe. Let's not be petty by voting No for the wrong reasons (i.e. to piss off the government!). The truth is that we need Europe more than ever right now, we are in the worst recession probably since the 1930s, and by far the worst performing economy in the EU. So we need all the help we can get right now, and voting No will not help our cause by any means!!

Bottom line (in case i haven't been clear): Vote YES to Lisbon, vote NO to FF in the next general election.

Wineher
(Economist)

PS - i am aware that i have not covered the point that we have already voted on the Lisbon Treaty and that our democratic right should be respected and that by voting again we are effectively making a mockery of that. That said, i think we need to be the bigger person here, and look at the bigger picture and determine for ourselves what is best for us.

Wow, that was a long rant, sorry guys!!

[TheNads]

The cunts are ambushing us with this 2nd chance. I reckon they think that we've vented our anger in the local & Euro elections & they have a chance of pushing this through now.
It's all being led by that cunt Dick Roche (or Cock Roche, as they call him on Newstalk's The Emergency). I ran him from my driveway recently when he doorstepped me & tried to gladhand me. He's one of the worst examples of why we should tar & feather all the current encumbents.
I honestly think that we need Europe like we never needed them before & if we give 2 fingers to this again then our position within Europe might never recover. I'm being pragmatic here. We're a little dot on the edge of Europe & there's a lot of people who already think that we should be cut loose if we say no again.
It's a bit like the Industrial Schools & Clerical Abuse debates. Because you're angry with the evil humans who perpetrated this, does that mean that God stops to exist ? (if that's what you believe).
Because we seem to agree now that all FFers are evil (by the way, if you voted for these cunts in 2007 then shut-up whinging, you bitch - you put them there !) doesn't mean that Lisbon is not a good idea.
Mind you, I never liked the common currency idea & we'd be in much shallower shit if we could have devalued our currency.
Just my tuppence.

[mij6969]

I agree with Wineher. Last time I voted NO - this time it will be a yes. The last referendum was held on the basis that the electorate were too stupid to understand but trust us politicians because we are clever and if you don't vote Yes the bogeyman will get you. So they were taught their lesson and had the suffer a year of embarassment in front of their euro counterparts.
This time around we understand the issues - they have been debated and guarantees will be in place to cover any ambigituities. This time around the referendum is about protecting our future in Europe by being in the mainstream but holding our position on neutrality, taxation etc.
I would never tell someone else how to vote - that is their choice and I believe that politicians should give their opinions but not tell others what to do. So, Politicians, if you want a YES vote, butt out and keep your posters in the shed and let people make their own choice.