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Thread: Evening Echo Article September 2014

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    Default Evening Echo Article September 2014

    Earlier I stumbled across an (very slightly outdated [though highly relevant]) article relating to the debate in relation to enactment and implementation of Swedish-style Legislation in relation to the Sex Industry.

    Click on the below link
    http://immigrantcouncil.ie/media/pre...g-echo-article

    From the article
    Comment

    Politicians must act on Carter call for sex buyer laws – article published in Evening Echo

    By Denise Charlton, Chief Executive, Immigrant Council of Ireland

    Cork TD’s and Senators must act on the call this week by former US President Jimmy Carter for Ireland to take a lead in introducing sex buyer laws to end exploitation, abuse and trafficking of women and girls.

    The more I think about "the Carter Letter", the more I think that Denise Charlton requested of Carter to write the letter. (It has also been outlined extensively by members of the E-I Community (as well as individuals whom have no connection with the E-I Community [or even any interest in this industry, for that matter]) that Swedish-style Legislation in relation to the Sex Industry imposes severe negative implications for the persons whom it supposedly serves to protect).

    The decision by President Carter to put pen to paper and write to the Taoiseach, the Minister for Justice and to every TD and Senator shows the international focus there is on Ireland to see if we will become the latest country to make life far more difficult for pimps, traffickers and thugs.
    In Ireland, pimping (and human trafficking) are both criminal offences, with both offences taken very seriously by the Gardai and Courts. Sweden (which implements Swedish-style Legislation) has been branded a "pimps and traffickers paradise" by Swedish Sex Workers (see Pye Jakobssen's insight to Sweden's Sex Industry for more).

    While he notes ‘the unanimous political support for such measures achieved at the Oireachtas Justice Committee’, President Carter goes on to point out that the recommendations for sex buyer laws is now more than 12-months old.
    Indeed since they were issued the findings the Committee, under the chair of Cork East Fine Gael TD David Stanton, appear to have been left gather dust somewhere in the Department of Justice.

    I followed the JOC Hearings in relation to the debate to enact and implement Swedish-style Legislation. David Stanton TD (as well as other members of the JOC) treated any individual who spoke against Swedish-style Legislation with utter contempt.

    Of course, the former US leader is not the only one to share the view that sex buyer laws make sense, it is a view shared by 70 Irish organisations of the Turn Off the Red Light Campaign.
    This statement is somewhat skewed; I could be wrong but I would reckon that Senior Management and CEO's of such organizations have "pledged support" to TORL (most likely for "public relations" reasons), with ordinary individual members of said organizations having no say in this matter.

    The Campaign is fortunate to have the support of Cork’s doctors, nurses, academics, business leaders, farming representatives, women’s and children’s rights campaigners and thousands of individuals who also support our efforts.
    Given that the fact that the Sex Industry (both for Sex Worker's and Client's) is so stigmatized, is it not possible that individuals referred to above (doctors, nurses, academics etc), upon being asked if they agree with the proposed Legislation will answer "yes I agree" in order to not give any indications that they are (or even, were) Clients (or former Sex Workers, for that matter).

    These members of the campaign, like President Carter, are looking to Cork’s TDs and Senators to act and end the delay which is allowing pimps to go about their business largely unhindered.
    Honestly, I believe that the overwhelming majority of ordinary individuals who support or agree with TORL are actually not 100% sure what they are supporting. I also believe that a considerable number of Political representatives who have publicly endorsed TORL do so for "public relations" reasons.

    Cork has a voice in cabinet with Minister Simon Coveney and is also the home of Fianna Fáil and opposition leader Micheál Martin, TD. They have a responsibility to build on the political agreement achieved at Committee level and move us to the position where laws can finally be introduced.

    In October the Immigrant Council of Ireland will act to push this issue further up the political agenda when we will present to all parties a bill we have drafted which will outlaw the purchase of sex.

    The underlined is particularly interesting; I would have to question why TORL published this within a regional/local newspaper whilst keeping such intentions away from national news publications.

    The details are currently being finalised by our legal advisors, however at this stage we can confirm our bill will introduce fines of up to €500 for those who attempt to buy sex and up to €3,000 and possible imprisonment for those men who do buy on a repeated basis.
    These proposed penalties we believe are enough to deter the men whose actions have created a market for trafficked women and girls – while at the same time would not place an undue burden on the income of a family of a sex buyer who has been caught.

    The above underlined is contradictory;
    • Many homosexual men pay other men for sex (this is not "creating a market for trafficked girls")


    • Women are known to pay men for sex (though admittely this is rare in Ireland [and is certainly not "creating a market for trafficked girls"]) and even pay other women for sex.

    (It is also worth noting that a number of Transgender individuals choose [of their own free will] to work in the Sex Industry)

    Predictably there are vested interests who have taken to social media to try and pour cold water on President Carter’s contribution to this debate – they are attempting to divert attention away from the criminality which lies at the heart of organised prostitution in Cork.
    Could "vested interests" mean Independent Sex Workers who are rightfully opposed to the enactment and implementation of Legislation which could affect their ability to conduct their business affairs (and even their lives) in a safe manner.

    It is a reality that as a frontline organisation the Immigrant Council of Ireland has supported 50 women trafficked into Ireland to face multiple rapes on a daily basis. This is not a small crime – in fact this is recognised internationally as the fastest growing crime and is more profitable than drug running for criminal gangs.
    It is worth noting that President Carter is not the only global figure to speak out in recent days. Pope Francis has declared that January 1st next will be a special day when the Catholic Church Worldwide will focus on human trafficking and the selling of men, women and children into forced prostitution.

    The Catholic Church are against abuse?

    As our laws stand, Ireland is a high profit-low risk destination for those behind these crimes.
    The thugs know that our existing legislation is out dated and is unable to respond to a ‘trade’ which has used the internet and mobile phone technology to move off the streets and indoors.

    As has been outlined on numerous occasions, pimping and human trafficking are already criminal offences which carry severe penalties. If human scum such as pimps take no note of the existing laws (Swedish-style Legislation has actually been of benefit to scum such as pimps and human traffickers in Sweden), it is highly unlikely that they will take note of future ones
    Last edited by The Equalizer; 14-09-14 at 17:22.
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  2. #2
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    I don't remember the last time an NGO drafted a piece of legislation and tried to ram down a Government's throat!
    The ICI should be our roaring from the roof tops on immigrants rights instead they are engaging in hysterical madness and if we don't have our wits about u,s this will destroy sex workers lives!
    Ride them on the beaches!

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    Anti prostitution/anti sex work laws are very difficult to draft, so Denise and her girleens legal advisors off their own bat would be incapable of drafting such complex legislation successful, is my guess! They might even criminalise heterosexual marriage with it, which I doubt the lovely Denise would mind! Roll on our first Lesbian (that we know of) President!
    Ride them on the beaches!

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    What right has the aul peanut farmer to interfere in the affairs of another sovereign country, the man is a proven gobshite!
    Last edited by The Libertarian; 14-09-14 at 19:38.
    Ride them on the beaches!

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    Interesting development as per Jim Cusack in today's Indo :

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news...30585049.html#

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Equalizer View Post
    Earlier I stumbled across an (very slightly outdated [though highly relevant]) article relating to the debate in relation to enactment and implementation of Swedish-style Legislation in relation to the Sex Industry.

    Click on the below link
    http://immigrantcouncil.ie/media/pre...g-echo-article

    From the article
    Comment

    Politicians must act on Carter call for sex buyer laws – article published in Evening Echo

    By Denise Charlton, Chief Executive, Immigrant Council of Ireland

    Cork TD’s and Senators must act on the call this week by former US President Jimmy Carter for Ireland to take a lead in introducing sex buyer laws to end exploitation, abuse and trafficking of women and girls.

    The more I think about "the Carter Letter", the more I think that Denise Charlton requested of Carter to write the letter. (It has also been outlined extensively by members of the E-I Community (as well as individuals whom have no connection with the E-I Community [or even any interest in this industry, for that matter]) that Swedish-style Legislation in relation to the Sex Industry imposes severe negative implications for the persons whom it supposedly serves to protect).

    The decision by President Carter to put pen to paper and write to the Taoiseach, the Minister for Justice and to every TD and Senator shows the international focus there is on Ireland to see if we will become the latest country to make life far more difficult for pimps, traffickers and thugs.
    In Ireland, pimping (and human trafficking) are both criminal offences, with both offences taken very seriously by the Gardai and Courts. Sweden (which implements Swedish-style Legislation) has been branded a "pimps and traffickers paradise" by Swedish Sex Workers (see Pye Jakobssen's insight to Sweden's Sex Industry for more).

    While he notes ‘the unanimous political support for such measures achieved at the Oireachtas Justice Committee’, President Carter goes on to point out that the recommendations for sex buyer laws is now more than 12-months old.
    Indeed since they were issued the findings the Committee, under the chair of Cork East Fine Gael TD David Stanton, appear to have been left gather dust somewhere in the Department of Justice.

    I followed the JOC Hearings in relation to the debate to enact and implement Swedish-style Legislation. David Stanton TD (as well as other members of the JOC) treated any individual who spoke against Swedish-style Legislation with utter contempt.

    Of course, the former US leader is not the only one to share the view that sex buyer laws make sense, it is a view shared by 70 Irish organisations of the Turn Off the Red Light Campaign.
    This statement is somewhat skewed; I could be wrong but I would reckon that Senior Management and CEO's of such organizations have "pledged support" to TORL (most likely for "public relations" reasons), with ordinary individual members of said organizations having no say in this matter.

    The Campaign is fortunate to have the support of Cork’s doctors, nurses, academics, business leaders, farming representatives, women’s and children’s rights campaigners and thousands of individuals who also support our efforts.
    Given that the fact that the Sex Industry (both for Sex Worker's and Client's) is so stigmatized, is it not possible that individuals referred to above (doctors, nurses, academics etc), upon being asked if they agree with the proposed Legislation will answer "yes I agree" in order to not give any indications that they are (or even, were) Clients (or former Sex Workers, for that matter).

    These members of the campaign, like President Carter, are looking to Cork’s TDs and Senators to act and end the delay which is allowing pimps to go about their business largely unhindered.
    Honestly, I believe that the overwhelming majority of ordinary individuals who support or agree with TORL are actually not 100% sure what they are supporting. I also believe that a considerable number of Political representatives who have publicly endorsed TORL do so for "public relations" reasons.

    Cork has a voice in cabinet with Minister Simon Coveney and is also the home of Fianna Fáil and opposition leader Micheál Martin, TD. They have a responsibility to build on the political agreement achieved at Committee level and move us to the position where laws can finally be introduced.

    In October the Immigrant Council of Ireland will act to push this issue further up the political agenda when we will present to all parties a bill we have drafted which will outlaw the purchase of sex.

    The underlined is particularly interesting; I would have to question why TORL published this within a regional/local newspaper whilst keeping such intentions away from national news publications.

    The details are currently being finalised by our legal advisors, however at this stage we can confirm our bill will introduce fines of up to €500 for those who attempt to buy sex and up to €3,000 and possible imprisonment for those men who do buy on a repeated basis.
    These proposed penalties we believe are enough to deter the men whose actions have created a market for trafficked women and girls – while at the same time would not place an undue burden on the income of a family of a sex buyer who has been caught.

    The above underlined is contradictory;
    • Many homosexual men pay other men for sex (this is not "creating a market for trafficked girls")


    • Women are known to pay men for sex (though admittely this is rare in Ireland [and is certainly not "creating a market for trafficked girls"]) and even pay other women for sex.

    (It is also worth noting that a number of Transgender individuals choose [of their own free will] to work in the Sex Industry)

    Predictably there are vested interests who have taken to social media to try and pour cold water on President Carter’s contribution to this debate – they are attempting to divert attention away from the criminality which lies at the heart of organised prostitution in Cork.
    Could "vested interests" mean Independent Sex Workers who are rightfully opposed to the enactment and implementation of Legislation which could affect their ability to conduct their business affairs (and even their lives) in a safe manner.

    It is a reality that as a frontline organisation the Immigrant Council of Ireland has supported 50 women trafficked into Ireland to face multiple rapes on a daily basis. This is not a small crime – in fact this is recognised internationally as the fastest growing crime and is more profitable than drug running for criminal gangs.
    It is worth noting that President Carter is not the only global figure to speak out in recent days. Pope Francis has declared that January 1st next will be a special day when the Catholic Church Worldwide will focus on human trafficking and the selling of men, women and children into forced prostitution.

    The Catholic Church are against abuse?

    As our laws stand, Ireland is a high profit-low risk destination for those behind these crimes.
    The thugs know that our existing legislation is out dated and is unable to respond to a ‘trade’ which has used the internet and mobile phone technology to move off the streets and indoors.

    As has been outlined on numerous occasions, pimping and human trafficking are already criminal offences which carry severe penalties. If human scum such as pimps take no note of the existing laws (Swedish-style Legislation has actually been of benefit to scum such as pimps and human traffickers in Sweden), it is highly unlikely that they will take note of future ones
    I kept trying to find passages to highlight , but it's all relevant.

    My question is : who the *uck (duck ) is Jimmy Carter ???

    Yes of ourselves I know his my ExPrez , but why on earth should he have such input in a foreign nation's internal politics ?


    I like the guy. He's done much good in the world ( most of it after he left office ) , but why should Ireland base its

    sex-work policy on the opinions of an asexual , ageing , misguided ideologist ??

    Madness. Madness , I tell you.
    I do what I want. I cannot do otherwise.

  9. #8
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    @The Equalizer

    "The more I think about "the Carter Letter", the more I think that Denise Charlton requested of Carter to write the letter."

    Ms Charlton admitted on RTE Radio that Jimmy Carter was "briefed by the Immigrant Council of Ireland prior to his writing the letter". You can be sure Ms Charlton more or less told him to write the letter and what it should say.

    This is sickening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie View Post
    I kept trying to find passages to highlight , but it's all relevant.

    My question is : who the *uck (duck ) is Jimmy Carter ???

    Yes of course I know his my ExPrez , but why on earth should he have such input in a sovereign nation's internal politics ?


    I like the guy. He's done much good in the world ( most of it after he left office ) , but why should Ireland base its

    sex-work policy on the opinions of an asexual , ageing , misguided ideologist ??

    Madness. Madness , I tell you.
    Oh the wonders of Autocorrect x
    I do what I want. I cannot do otherwise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie View Post
    Oh the wonders of Autocorrect x
    I have a friend whose surname is Condon .............. you can imagine to what what autocorrect alters it!

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