Very important- please get involved with consultation/submission before 31st August!!

[Jack in the Box]

Everyone needs to get involved with the government consultation on sex work!

For those of you unfamiliar with recent events I will summarise what has happened.

Ruhama, the Immigrant Council of Ireland and other NGO’s wish the government to criminalise the clients of sex workers which is an outrageous abuse of people’s rights. They claim that it will reduce crime which is untrue.

The government has published a consultation on sex work which can be obtained at either of the following link:

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PB12000187

This is a balanced document which is different than the biased information that Ruhama and their friends produce. It is meant for the public to read and help them form an opinion. Using these opinions the government will decide what legislation to draft.

It is important that users of this site have a look or a read of this consultation. As many as possible should then make a submission which can done using the following link:

http://www.oireachtas.ie/parliament/mediazone/pressreleases/name-8688-en.html

The link points us to the email address for making a submission which is:

justiceanddefence@oir.ie

After submissions are made there will be a conference on sex work sometime in the Autumn according to announcements. The more than can attend this conference the better.

Banjaxed has a good summary of instruction at the following link:

https://www.escort-ireland.com/boards/threads/94963-Prostitution-Consultation-Update

Also you can email anonymously or not anonymously. Even if you decide not to submit anonymously your details will not be disclosed upon request. See The Traveller’s post on page 3 at the following link:

https://www.escort-ireland.com/boards/threads/95793-Very-important-please-get-involved-with-the-government-consultation-and-submissions!

The deadline for submitting is Friday 31st August!!

Please take a stand against Ruhama and other dictatorial NGO’s. As many escorts as possible need to show that they have a right to operate and do not need NGO’s to describe them as victims. Others including ex-sex workers and clients need to make their views known as well. As many people as possible need to do this. If Ruhama had their way Escort-Ireland would be just a talking shop.

[the traveller]

Rather than following the link this was the clerk of the committees reply

All submissions, when made, become Parliamentary papers and the property of the Committee. This means that the Committee may decide to publish these and the information contained will be public. However, due to the topic being examined the Committee has agreed that where requested, any information likely to identify the sender would be omitted/redacted.

If you intend to make a written submission, I suggest that you should break it into two parts:

(i) a cover letter providing your contact details (this will only be used by the secretariat to communicate with you in relation to your submission), and

(ii) the content of your submission. This does not need to be a long document and need only contain any comments you may have regarding any revision(s) to the laws relating to prostitution. However, it should be clearly linked to the cover letter, for example, you could use an obvious reference number on the letter which is also on the submission heading. (If I am complicating things, give me a call)

Submissions should be sent to the e-mail address justiceanddefence@oir.ie - clearly indicating in the subject field "submission on the review of Laws relating to Prostitution". The cover letter should be addressed to:

Alan Guidon
Clerk to the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality
Leinster House,
Dublin 2.

My two colleagues are Mr Pat Neary (618 3153) and Ms Barbara Hughes (618 3918). Pat and Barbara are fully aware that the submissions on this topic may contain sensitive information and the personal details will be handled appropriately.

If you require any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact me.

Kind Regards

Alan

Alan Guidon
Clerk to the Committee

Tel: 01- 618 3899

[Jack in the Box]

This post regarding anonymity should put to rest any concerns people have and allows individuals to authenticate more without any risk (perceived or otherwise) to themselves.

[notoften]

Well done "jack in the Box" for such an informative e-mail, we have to fight this
in case the anti prostitution nutters get their misinformed and bias views believed in.

I will send a submission on the sillyiness and unsuccessful Swedish style laws
which may be considered for Ireland straight away.
A Swedish style law that criminalsies clients of escorts will not help vunerable
women or men in the sex industry and will not reduce crime.
I just hope escorts and users of this site realise how important this is and
also send a submission to the link.
Can you imagine what a law like this would do, no more seeing escorts,
it is too horrible to thing about
Regards

[Jack in the Box]

Fair play to you Notoften. Well said. We should keep unwanted Swedish laws out of this country. If we all do our bit it will make a big impact.

[Jack in the Box]

I received further clarification from the submission staff regarding anonymity. If you wish to give your true details (for bone fide reasons maybe) just put them on a separate document for the sole purpose of communication with the secretariat as was explained in The Traveller's post above. However you can use your TRUE email if you want for either document and it will not be revealed to the public if requested. So if you want you don't have to use mickeymouse@hollywood.com!

Below is a copy of a post from the Traveller with links for assistance in the submission:



I posted these links in another place here but one that is rarely read so here they are again in one handy post.
They are all relevant to a submission and I hope they help in forming an argument.

Nick Davies The Guardian How numbers have been exaggerated and exploited.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/oc...en-exaggerated

Liam Clarke Belfast Telegraph Numbers in recent police visits.
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/op...-16169164.html

The Local Norways news in English Oslo politician says "rip up law"
http://www.thelocal.no/page/view/rip...slo-politician

Anthony Andrew The Observer Police corruption in Sweden
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010...me?INTCMP=SRCH

The Local Swedens news in English Sweden tops Euro league for rape.
http://www.thelocal.se/19102/20090427/

A voice for men Swedens radical feminists.
http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism...ance-feminism/

Pye Jacobsson Swedish sex worker video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7D7nOh57-I8

Edith V Government Agent Cartoon of sex worker Funny but so true.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw0fs...layer_embedded

I'm sure there are more out there and if anyone finds others please feel free to add to this list.
Perhaps if we ask Doodlebug nicely, as he's read Ruhama's annual report, he'll point out any relevant parts for a submission. This day next week is the last day for the submission so lets not sleepwalk into a world created by radical feminists and religious zealots.

[Morpheus]

One day to go folks before the deadline.


Speak now or forever hold your silence!!!!!!;)

[Lucy Chambers]

I am struggling with the main body of this submission. If possible if anyone here has already done theirs would you mind letting me have a look at it? I need inspiration. I have some time to do this today so asap would be great :)

[Patricia]

I am struggling with the main body of this submission. If possible if anyone here has already done theirs would you mind letting me have a look at it? I need inspiration. I have some time to do this today so asap would be great :)

If you don't have a lot of time, I would skip "Total Criminalisation" part as nobody much is calling for that anyway I think, so no great need to argue against. I think the main thing is to argue against what you find wrong with "Partial Criminalisation", e.g. law forcing ladies to work alone under our existing partial criminalisation law and criminalisation of clients under swedish partial criminalisation law being proposed by TORL. Then if you support Decriminalisation or Legalisation/Regulation, add some about which of those you support and why. Also any other points you want to make that there are no questions about, e.g. would you like a Garda liason offer for sex workers to be appointed, would you like to see an Ugly Mugs scheme like UKNSWP Ugly Mugs set up. Don't try to answer all the questions. It's too much. Instead look at it like writing a letter simply expressing your views on some important points.

[max california]

Done, not the greatest submission they're gping to read but at least it's something

[Morpheus]

Done, not the greatest submission they're gping to read but at least it's something

Damn right Max! At least it is something!:) Same with mine! At least we both got ours in, which is the main thing. It's a bit like the right to vote. If you don't exercise it, then there is no point complaining about the outcome!

I think a lot of folk are worried that they need to do a thesis on the law governing prostitution! We can leave that to Banjaxed!;)

I think the main thing is to get something in. No matter how short. Patricia's advice is spot on, as always.

I really think that numbers matter - and the more submissions they see that back decriminalizing escorting and opposing any further criminalization (such as the Swedish model) will matter. Politicians afterall can count votes!

[Lucy Chambers]

Done :)

Thanks so much to the people that sent me stuff, I am in your debt.

x

[Banjaxed]

I think a lot of folk are worried that they need to do a thesis on the law governing prostitution! We can leave that to Banjaxed! ;)
Someone else outdone me with a 77 page submission I'm afraid. :D Though mine mightn't be as liberal as some would like, so like Turn off the Red Light and Ruhama's submission, it's confidential. :p

[BootSlick55]

I've got Page Not Found on all article links above from Jack In The Box. Could they be refreshed? Sorry to be a pain.

[Patricia]

I've got Page Not Found on all article links above from Jack In The Box. Could they be refreshed? Sorry to be a pain.

Here is alternative quick guide http://sexwork.ie/2012/08/30/24-hours-to-act/

[Banjaxed]

I've got Page Not Found on all article links above from Jack In The Box. Could they be refreshed? Sorry to be a pain.

At this stage we've either won or we've perished as Ms Chambers has a submission on the go, I'm sure that if my experience is anything to go by, they'll hang on her every word whatever it might be! I look forward to my spot in the Sunday World, I can see it now, "EXCLUSIVE. Self-confessed brothel legal eagle and pint sized thug caught in sleaze swoop"

:D

You better make use of them!

Nick Davies, Prostitution and trafficking – the anatomy of a moral panic, The Guardian, Tuesday 20 October 2009
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/oct/20/trafficking-numbers-women-exaggerated

Liam Clarke, We can't abandon girls to mercy of the underworld, Belfast Telegraph, 8th June 2012
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/liam-clarke/we-cant-abandon-girls-to-mercy-of-the-underworld-16169164.html

NTB/The Local, 'Rip up prostituion law' says top Oslo Politician, 22 June 2012
http://www.thelocal.no/page/view/rip-up-prostitution-law-says-top-oslo-politician

Andrew Anthony, Göran Lindberg and Sweden's dark side, 1st August 2010
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/aug/01/goran-lindberg-sweden-crime-palme

NTB/The Local, Sweden tops European rape league, 27 April 2009
http://www.thelocal.se/19102/20090427/

A Voice for Men, The radical feminist conquest of Sweden, 19th July 2012
http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism/government-tyranny/the-radfem-conquest-of-sweden/

[the traveller]

Thanks Banjaxed, the original articles are posted here,
https://www.escort-ireland.com/boards/threads/97477-Very-important-please-get-involved-with-consultation-submission-before-August-31st!!/page2

And they still work.

[Banjaxed]

And that's all, folks. The show has ended two minutes ago now.

[Jack in the Box]

Apologies to everybody that those links didn't work. I copied and pasted them from a different thread and the format must have slightly altered in doing that. Also a very big thumbs up to everybody that sent in a submission!

[Sexy Sandy 69]

Does anyone have any idea when the outcome of this bill will be disclosed or is it still 'a work in progress?' It would be interesting if we were informed how many objections were submitted. It would be great to know that 'our voice' was listened to & taken into consideration.

Also, as I read in the Sunday Papers, more Garda stations are to close, so do I take the officers from these stations will be moved to other stations or does that mean that there will be less Gardai to do more work, including prosecuting clients amongst others?

Sandy x

[Banjaxed]

Does anyone have any idea when the outcome of this bill will be disclosed or is it still 'a work in progress?' It would be interesting if we were informed how many objections were submitted. It would be great to know that 'our voice' was listened to & taken into consideration.

Also, as I read in the Sunday Papers, more Garda stations are to close, so do I take the officers from these stations will be moved to other stations or does that mean that there will be less Gardai to do more work, including prosecuting clients amongst others?

Sandy x

At present no Bill has been drafted, and the consultation process is still ongoing as some type of conference is to be held in the coming months. I estimate given that the government have bigger issues to deal with, that it'll take a year for this to actually come onto the cards.

[copperslad]

An up hill battle I'd say.